IRC Log for #microformats on 2006-03-24
Timestamps are in UTC.
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[[Main Page]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Main_Page&diff=0&oldid=5513 * Micah Sittig * (-198) Error confirmation and correction
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amanuel is Amanuel, the social ambassador at http://otavo.com
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- [01:35:40] <jibot>
BenjaminCarlyle is http://soundadvice.id.au/blog/, GMT 1000
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- [02:06:01] <jibot>
pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
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tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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[[events/xtech-2006]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/xtech-2006&diff=0&oldid=5514 * Brian * (+241) added ideas
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- [04:59:41] <bewest>
where is the proof of concept that lets you copy and paste hcards between IE and firefox?
- [04:59:50] * bewest hopes for a swift response
- [05:00:58] <bewest>
and is there a microformat for styled citations? maybe one for chicago and one for mla, and one for APA?
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- [05:02:18] <KevinMarks>
bewest: Ray ozzie's?
- [05:02:58] <KevinMarks>
there are some attempts at citations; typographci styling is in the CSS realm though
- [05:03:23] <bewest>
I mean style as in APA is a style..
- [05:03:31] <bewest>
as in style guide for the paper...
- [05:03:33] <bewest>
maybe it doesn't matter
- [05:03:38] <bewest>
but I didnt' mean typographic
- [05:03:41] <bewest>
ray ozzie?
- [05:04:38] <KevinMarks>
http://spaces.msn.com/rayozzie/blog/cns!FB3017FBB9B2E142!285.entry
- [05:04:42] <bewest>
great
- [05:04:46] <bewest>
thanks!
- [05:06:26] <bewest>
it's neat that MS is buying into the MF mindshare
- [05:09:19] <KevinMarks>
it is, btu we are going to need to work hard with them to keep them converged
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- [07:16:25] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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mlinksva is Mike Linksvayer and from Creative Commons
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- [09:27:10] <mfbot>
[[resume-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=resume-examples&diff=0&oldid=5515 * Jax * (+74) Experiments in microformatting -
- [09:30:56] <mfbot>
[[resume-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=resume-examples&diff=0&oldid=5516 * Jax * (-74) Experiments in microformatting -
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- [13:22:19] <mfbot>
[[plant-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=plant-examples&diff=0&oldid=5517 * Mark Gibbons * (+526) [http://www.crocus.co.uk/findplant/ Crocus] -
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[[plant-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=plant-examples&diff=0&oldid=5518 * Mark Gibbons * (+389) [http://www.paghat.com/garden.html Paghat's Garden] -
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[[plant-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=plant-examples&diff=0&oldid=5519 * Mark Gibbons * (-3) [http://www.paghat.com/garden.html Paghat's Garden] -
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[[plant-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=plant-examples&diff=0&oldid=5520 * Mark Gibbons * (+191) The Problem -
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- [13:52:49] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-faq]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-faq&diff=0&oldid=5521 * EtanWexler * (+2519) mod_rewrite examples; URL syntax clarification; typographical, hypertextual, and editorial niceties
- [13:55:15] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-faq]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-faq&diff=0&oldid=5522 * EtanWexler * (-6) RewriteRule correction
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- [15:22:48] <_fil_>
I don't understand: this page http://fil.rezo.net/spip/sedna/
- [15:22:56] <_fil_>
looks to me nicely hAtom
- [15:23:19] <_fil_>
but hAtom2Atom does not seem to read the "author" <span>
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- [15:24:47] <pnhChris>
hatom 0.1 requires the author to be an hcard... http://microformats.org/wiki/hatom#Entry_Author
- [15:25:19] <_fil_>
I don't like it...
- [15:25:30] <_fil_>
I don't have enough information to fill the data
- [15:26:00] <_fil_>
is an almost empty hcard better than a small text field?
- [15:26:08] <pnhChris>
regardless, that's why hAtom2Atom is not parsing it
- [15:26:16] <_fil_>
ok
- [15:29:32] <_fil_>
can I do <span class="author vcard fn">Name</span> ?
- [15:29:45] <_fil_>
I meanb, is this compliant with the spec?
- [15:30:10] <_fil_>
or MUST i embed <span><span><span> for each of these classes?
- [15:30:28] <pnhChris>
i think author and the vcard stuff need to be nested
- [15:30:40] <pnhChris>
but check the specs for how you can shorten the hcard
- [15:31:17] <pnhChris>
wait.. i'm wrong
- [15:31:19] <pnhChris>
think its this
- [15:31:20] <pnhChris>
<span class="author vcard"><span class="fn">Chris</span></span>
- [15:31:27] <pnhChris>
is the shortest you can get legally
- [15:31:52] * pnhChris looks around the room for confirmation
- [15:32:01] * _fil_ finds this too complex
- [15:32:07] <dglazkov>
full name: FirstName LastName
- [15:32:21] <_fil_>
dglazkov: I don't write the data
- [15:32:34] <_fil_>
it's coming from syndicated rss stuff
- [15:32:52] <pnhChris>
dglazkov: yes. .but there was some mf related optimizations
- [15:33:42] <dglazkov>
this is already an optimization: http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard#Implied_.22n.22_Optimization
- [15:34:08] <dglazkov>
_fil_: I actually tend to agree with you. Maybe you should document this as an issue
- [15:34:31] <dglazkov>
http://microformats.org/wiki/hatom-issues
- [15:34:53] <_fil_>
look here
- [15:34:54] <_fil_>
http://fil.rezo.net/spip/sedna/
- [15:35:05] <_fil_>
the author is "Béatrice Mouédine beatrice.mouedine?tvagri.com"
- [15:35:10] <_fil_>
the author is "Béatrice Mouédine beatrice.mouedine@@tvagri.com"
- [15:35:24] <_fil_>
the @@ is a strange character meant to be a kind of antispam
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- [15:35:53] <_fil_>
I don't really know this person, it's just data that's collected and will be passed untouched
- [15:35:56] <_fil_>
as "the author"
- [15:37:02] <pnhChris>
i don't disagree either.. the field often comes from places too dumb to follow these rules wel
- [15:37:39] <_fil_>
I don't know how to explain it on the hatom-issues page
- [15:37:51] <_fil_>
at the end? or in the "Entry Author" section?
- [15:39:15] <pnhChris>
even cases like wordpress that allow users to present their name 1 of 6 or 8 difference ways (from username to LF, FN) .. its not just writing a template to output as hatom at that point... you have to go further upstream where the string to be displayed is chosen
- [15:39:21] <pnhChris>
the later _fil_
- [15:40:01] <pnhChris>
.. I also think its pointless to have 10 vcards on the same page whose only data is a generic name like "Chris"
- [15:40:18] <pnhChris>
but its all been said before
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- [15:40:52] <_fil_>
Do I add your comments?
- [15:41:15] <pnhChris>
if you'd like
- [15:42:20] <pnhChris>
are you putting it in the 0.1 section or the 0.2 section?
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- [15:42:45] <_fil_>
Which is best?
- [15:44:00] <pnhChris>
i'd think 0.2.. since the call was clearly made for 0.1 already.. but please if you're doing it include your example and where the data comes from
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- [15:46:19] <mfbot>
[[hatom-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-issues&diff=0&oldid=5523 * Fil * (+1143) hAtom 0.2 - Author as hCard is too complex to *require*
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- [15:48:15] <mfbot>
[[hatom-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-issues&diff=0&oldid=5524 * Fil * (+166) author as an hcard is too much to require -
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- [15:52:11] <mfbot>
[[hatom-issues]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-issues&diff=0&oldid=5525 * Fil * (+0) fix sedna website address
- [15:54:03] <_fil_>
http://sedna.spip.org/sedna/ should be hAtom 0.1 compliant now (almost)
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- [16:50:51] <davecardwell>
is http://www.webstandards.org/action/dwtf/microformats/ mentioned anywhere on the wiki yet?
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- [17:01:02] <tantek>
greetings
- [17:04:02] <dglazkov>
hey tantek
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- [17:05:06] <dglazkov>
care if we start a "microformats-for-dummies" brainstorming page?
- [17:05:13] <dglazkov>
on wiki that is?
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- [17:08:59] <tantek>
what does that mean?
- [17:09:17] * tantek doesn't like the "... for dummies" series. It implies too many negative connotations.
- [17:09:48] <tantek>
wouldn't something like "getting started with ... " be better?
- [17:10:12] <dglazkov>
wield the wordsmith's hammer! :)
- [17:10:25] <mfbot>
[[hatom-issues]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-issues&diff=0&oldid=5526 * Tantek * (+543)
- [17:10:58] <dglazkov>
http://microformats.org/discuss/mail/microformats-discuss/2006-March/003333.html
- [17:12:13] <dglazkov>
I am trying to get Chris/Tara/others to collaborate
- [17:12:42] <tantek>
Al's makes the right point.
- [17:12:51] <tantek>
Demos speak louder than any amount of simplified wording.
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- [17:13:58] <dglazkov>
I am up to anything you name it, just as long as it hits the intended audience.
- [17:13:59] <tantek>
the best way to write an "Introduction to microformats" presentation is to start with something simple, try it on some folks, and iterate
- [17:14:18] <tantek>
it's also good if you have experience writing "Introduction to ... " presentations in general
- [17:14:40] <tantek>
do you know who your intended audience is? have you spoken with them?
- [17:15:09] <tantek>
writing an introduction presentation out of good intent but in a vacuum is not likely to succeed.
- [17:15:22] <tantek>
hence my advice: start with something simple, try it on some folks, and iterate
- [17:15:45] <dglazkov>
you're preaching to the choir :)
- [17:16:04] <tantek>
the "What are microformats?" presentations have done this over time, so hopefully you can iterate on the work there rather than starting from scratch: http://microformats.org/wiki/presentations
- [17:16:20] <tantek>
and please use S5 for maximum reusability/remixability. no more PDF/PPT please.
- [17:17:03] <dglazkov>
sounds like a plan
- [17:17:09] <tantek>
and if you're interested in helping out many sorts of audiences, perhaps start by documenting WHO those audiences are
- [17:17:34] <tantek>
currently microformats have been targeted at web designers, which are the folks who are most able to understand them quickly and use them
- [17:18:15] <tantek>
this messaging also tends to work for web programmers, though they sometimes have some resistance due to misplaced dependencies on namespaces, abstractions, ideal models etc.
- [17:18:41] <dglazkov>
right. I did a very rough outline of goals/audiences: http://microformats.org/discuss/mail/microformats-discuss/2006-March/003329.html
- [17:19:20] <tantek>
Tara is talking about essentially crafting an *even simpler* message documenting the benefits etc. for folks who will likely never author microformats themselves, because they don't author HTML today: marketing/communication folks etc.
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- [17:19:47] <dglazkov>
yup. So perhaps multiple pitches, with high reuse of concepts, definitions?
- [17:19:59] <tantek>
hmm.. the audience you describe is not one I have seen
- [17:20:41] <tantek>
and is not the audience that Tara is talking about
- [17:20:52] * tantek sets mode +o RobertBachmann
- [17:21:03] <tantek>
this is the problem with the "dummies" characterization
- [17:21:31] <mfbot>
[[hatom-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-issues&diff=0&oldid=5527 * ChrisCasciano * (+869) author as an hcard is too much to require -
- [17:23:26] <dglazkov>
my audience (as I tried to portray it, perhaps inaccurately), is heavily borrowed from this organization: http://ipsaonline.org/
- [17:23:37] <pnhAway>
I think the "dummies" audience that I see needs to be hit will only come with more tools and explicit examples of leveraging things... but that audience are web developers not working on the scale of a flickr who might see the "added value" propositions as the win over semantics or mysterious aggregators
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- [17:24:30] <pnhAway>
(tools as in .. tails, feed readers using hatom, etc)
- [17:24:46] * pnhAway goes back away again
- [17:24:49] <dglazkov>
I can still hear you pnhAway!
- [17:24:53] <dglazkov>
:)
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- [17:32:47] <tantek>
we're definitely getting to the point where we need to more and better "intro" and "how to use" and "how to author/publish" materials for a broad audience
- [17:33:28] <dglazkov>
no kidding. I've had more friends/colleagues ask about mfs this week than... than ever
- [17:33:41] <tantek>
dglazkov, in your goals, I don't see anything about: * how microformats are useful, * how to author/publish microformats etc.
- [17:33:44] <tantek>
think more real world
- [17:33:48] <tantek>
think useful *today*
- [17:34:08] <dglazkov>
ok
- [17:34:25] <tantek>
avoid simple "general understanding" and "bigger picture" stuff -- that stuff just causes most folks to dismiss it (whatever you're talking about) as academic, theoretical etc.
- [17:34:56] <tantek>
and frankly, going from theory to the process of creating new microformats makes nearly no sense for begginers
- [17:35:11] <dglazkov>
right
- [17:35:21] <tantek>
these folks just want to get things done. they want to use microformats to improve their work, their web sites etc.
- [17:35:30] * pnhAway is now known as pnhChris
- [17:35:43] <pnhChris>
aye.. .i'm not thinking of the "make another mf" audience
- [17:35:46] <tantek>
they don't care about any kind of idealistic crusades, nor do they really have the time/patience/desire to participate in a standards process of any kind
- [17:36:25] <dglazkov>
one thing I was wrestling with is how to bypass discussion on semantic markup and its merits, because you can probably spend a whole session just on that
- [17:36:29] <tantek>
for most folks, the best thing to do is to show an effective demonstration, explain what happened, explain how they too can do the same thing on their sites
- [17:36:32] <tantek>
and that's pretty much it
- [17:36:36] <pnhChris>
... one of the reasons I was playing with NNW yesterday was to get something I could write up as an "ok, i implemented hatom, now what"
- [17:37:03] <pnhChris>
which I'll write up as soon as I'm happy that applescript is working/portable
- [17:37:05] <dglazkov>
I think a good demo is a must
- [17:37:07] <pnhChris>
probably this weekend
- [17:37:12] <tantek>
dglazkov, semantic markup and microformats are part of the larger discussion about how do you become a modern web designer/developer
- [17:37:52] <tantek>
and a good demo can simply be showing an existing page which is relevant to the audience, marked up with hCards, and then converted to vCards and added to an Address Book
- [17:38:15] <tantek>
or the same with hCalendar markup, converted to iCalendar, and subscribed/displayed in a calendaring program
- [17:38:38] <tantek>
that's really all you need to explain it. don't overthink the demo. simple, straightforward, and immediately practical is the key
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- [17:38:55] <dglazkov>
I am afraid if I show this to IPSA folks, their reaction will be ".. and?"
- [17:39:18] <tantek>
then don't worry about showing it to them. perhaps they are not ready for it yet.
- [17:39:32] <tantek>
not all audiences will appreciate/adopt microformats at the same rate
- [17:39:52] <tantek>
are you afraid because you have tried and gotten that reaction already?
- [17:40:03] <tantek>
theoretical fears are useless (and often quite misplaced)
- [17:42:28] <dglazkov>
I haven't shown the demo, but
- [17:42:48] <dglazkov>
I have explained the idea behind it to a couple of folks here
- [17:43:29] <dglazkov>
and I found that the biggest problem is inability to extrapolate
- [17:43:42] <tantek>
that's the problem then
- [17:44:09] <tantek>
explaining the idea is not nearly as effective as first demonstrating and then explaining what happened
- [17:44:27] <tantek>
it's difficult to extrapolate from theoretical handwaving
- [17:44:42] <tantek>
whereas it is much easier to understand a concrete demo with real data and extrapolate from there
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- [17:45:17] <tantek>
you have to put in the time yourself to markup a page that is relevant to the audience with hCards, put in a link to the converter, make sure it works, and then demonstrate it
- [17:45:31] <tantek>
no amount of "explaining the idea" will make up for that
- [17:46:30] <dglazkov>
you're right, it will help
- [17:47:06] <tantek>
it will more than help. it will make all the difference.
- [17:47:52] <dglazkov>
well, as you said, let's try it, reflect, and iterate. Right?
- [17:50:05] <DanC>
+1 "mark up a page that is relevant to the audience". meet them where they're at.
- [17:50:39] * DanC considers the impact of the success disaster that is mix06
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- [17:51:17] <DanC>
did it have to be _this week_, the week I finally managed to get the SPARQL CR transition to happen? ;-)
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- [17:52:06] <DanC>
yo, elias.
- [17:52:08] <tantek>
dglazkov, right, what I'm telling you is from several iterations of having tried it, reflected, and iterated already
- [17:52:33] <tantek>
nearly all the recent conferences where microformats have been discussed we've given such demos, and people "got it"
- [17:52:56] <DanC>
case in point:
- [17:52:57] <DanC>
http://austin.adactio.com/
- [17:53:01] <tantek>
yes
- [17:53:21] <DanC>
(which inspired me personally to hack http://dm93.org/2006geo/where.html [not a cool url] )
- [17:53:45] <DanC>
right down to the shiner logo. Where did you find that guy, tantek?
- [17:54:20] <tantek>
Jeremy Keith rocks
- [17:54:29] <tantek>
he is a web designer
- [17:54:48] <dglazkov>
damn, I wish it worked so well on PC.
- [17:54:51] <tantek>
to all web programmers/developers out there: watch and listen to the web designers. they know more than you think.
- [17:55:51] <DanC>
hear hear. "Quality communication on the Web is a mixture of poetry, graphic design, interactive user interface design, and database application. " -- yours truely, Jan '97. http://www.w3.org/People/Connolly/9701webapps.html
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- [17:59:37] <dglazkov>
tantek, the demo that Al references, which one is that?
- [17:59:42] * DanC wonders if elias has looked at http://dm93.org/2006geo/where.html
- [18:00:24] <dglazkov>
btw, http://austin.adactio.com fails to impress a Windows/Office user
- [18:01:37] <DanC>
er... it doesn't work on windows?
- [18:02:14] <dglazkov>
outlook doesn't eat multiple events/contacts
- [18:02:20] <dglazkov>
you only get one.
- [18:02:31] <DanC>
er... the impact of the demo doesn't rely on outlook integration
- [18:02:43] <DanC>
I suppose to impress a windows/office user, it might...
- [18:02:57] <DanC>
... but the audience was shiner-drinkin' austinites, not windows/office users
- [18:03:21] <dglazkov>
.. and hence the impact
- [18:03:35] <DanC>
ok, point taken.
- [18:04:15] <DanC>
tantek, did anybody write down the story he told while giving the demo? it was totally compelling... he showed that two events were close; a third one that he was considering that evening was far away, so he said "sorry, I won't make that one"
- [18:04:49] <DanC>
I don't think he said "crawling distance" out loud, but I'm sure I wasn't the only one thinking it ;-)
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- [18:07:01] <dglazkov>
he annevk! long time no speak/hear/email/argue about stuff
- [18:07:46] <dglazkov>
and by "he" I meant "hey"
- [18:08:17] <annevk>
hi there
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- [18:53:20] <tantek>
dglazkov, see event page for W3C plenary microformats session
- [18:54:17] <tantek>
in general, you can find all this stuff by going to either http://microformats.org/wiki/events (for recent/upcoming stuff) and clicking through to the specific event pages (which then link to specific presentations and demo pages), or for past presentations: http://microformats.org/wiki/presentations
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- [19:38:08] <EliasT>
http://dm93.org/2006geo/where.html is cool!
- [19:38:24] <EliasT>
We are going to have to include it you know where...
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- [20:37:13] <mfbot>
[[Main Page]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Main_Page&diff=0&oldid=5528 * RodBegbie * (+20) Exploratory discussions - adding music-examples page
- [20:37:34] <mfbot>
[[music-examples]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/music-examples * RodBegbie * (+687) Pasting in examples-template for now
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- [20:54:46] <mfbot>
[[music-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=music-examples&diff=0&oldid=5529 * RodBegbie * (+1808) Scribbled TODOs for me to fill out over the weekend
- [20:55:52] <mfbot>
[[Main Page]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Main_Page&diff=0&oldid=5530 * TimG * (+31) Added exploratory discussion for work of art microformat
- [20:57:28] <mfbot>
[[work-of-art]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/work-of-art * TimG * (+568) Created index page for work of art microformat exploratory discussion
- [21:02:14] <mfbot>
[[workofart-examples]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/workofart-examples * TimG * (+1344) Created Examples page for work of art microformat
- [21:04:30] <mfbot>
[[workofart-formats]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/workofart-formats * TimG * (+1043) Created format page for work of art microformat
- [21:05:36] <mfbot>
[[workofart-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=workofart-examples&diff=0&oldid=5531 * TimG * (+5) Changed "Authors" to "Participants"
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[[workofart-brainstorming]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/workofart-brainstorming * TimG * (+3284) Created Brainstorming page for Work of Art Microformat
- [21:26:14] <mfbot>
[[workofart-brainstorming]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=workofart-brainstorming&diff=0&oldid=5532 * TimG * (+3) minor formatting changes
- [21:27:10] <mfbot>
[[workofart-brainstorming]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=workofart-brainstorming&diff=0&oldid=5533 * TimG * (-6) Strawman 1 -
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[[hatom-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-issues&diff=0&oldid=5534 * Fil * (+470) author as an hcard is too much to require - precisions re: tantek's question
- [21:52:02] <mfbot>
[[workofart-brainstorming]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=workofart-brainstorming&diff=0&oldid=5535 * TimG * (+204) Added a question, clarified another in Strawman 1 -
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[[hatom-issues]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-issues&diff=0&oldid=5536 * Fil * (+17) author as an hcard is too much to require - correct signature for Fil
- [21:53:19] <mfbot>
[[hatom-issues]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-issues&diff=0&oldid=5537 * Fil * (+0) author as an hcard is too much to require - hum... wanted to preview, sorry
- [21:54:58] * WPU (n=chatzill@c-24-98-136-188.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #microformats
- [21:56:49] <WPU>
greetings
- [22:01:41] <mfbot>
[[User:Fil]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=User:Fil&diff=0&oldid=5538 * Fil * (+290)
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- [22:29:24] <kingryan>
hi WPU
- [22:29:44] <WPU>
hey ryan
- [22:29:48] <WPU>
question.
- [22:30:34] <kingryan>
yeah?
- [22:31:04] <WPU>
if I'm making an hCard and working on an adr section . . . Can I put class="value postal-code" (postal-code as an example)?
- [22:31:10] <WPU>
the type is a home address
- [22:31:31] <WPU>
or is value unnecessary in that instance.
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- [22:31:44] <WPU>
I could post the code if that is more helpful
- [22:31:50] <kingryan>
value is only needed when you have a type and a value
- [22:31:56] <kingryan>
code would be good
- [22:32:19] * ceedub|lunch is now known as cee-dub
- [22:34:33] <WPU>
Here we go: http://pastebin.com/620802
- [22:35:26] <briansuda>
the 'value' portion is not needed, otherwise i think it looks good
- [22:36:17] <kingryan>
that's what I thought, thanks brian
- [22:36:42] <briansuda>
The only time you really need 'value' is with TEL and EMAIL (not so much email)
- [22:37:11] <kingryan>
btw, the gmaps link is wrong
- [22:37:25] <briansuda>
for TEL you will need a 'wrapper' class="tel" around both the type of phone number and the number itself
- [22:37:48] <briansuda>
so you will need something like: <span class="tel">+1.234.567.8901</span>
- [22:38:05] <briansuda>
that's valid by itself, now if you want to add a type you will need to add that inside the span
- [22:38:34] <briansuda>
<span class="tel"><span class="type">work</span> +1.234.567.8901</span>
- [22:38:55] <briansuda>
now we need to say what part is the value, we already marked-up which portion is the type
- [22:39:13] <briansuda>
<span class="tel"><span class="type">work</span> <span class="value">+1.234.567.8901</span></span>
- [22:40:00] <briansuda>
that's the most common use, i hope that helps answer your question
- [22:41:12] <WPU>
I just made something up for gmaps, but thanks though. Thanks to both of you!
- [22:42:43] <WPU>
This is what I had for tel: http://pastebin.com/620821
- [22:44:38] <WPU>
Am I the only one that thinks mobile should be used instead of cell. Cell just seems like it could become deprecated a lot sooner.
- [22:46:23] <yamico>
Over here in Germany, the people call it "Handy", but mobile (phone) is understood, whereas no one has an idea about "cell".
- [22:47:11] <_fil_>
same stuff in France, "mobile" is good, "cell" is unknown
- [22:53:46] <kingryan>
of course, they were all called 'cell' when vcard was started
- [22:54:09] <kingryan>
(at least, here in the states)
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- [22:58:15] <hober>
I think I only hear 'mobile' in advertisements here (.us); people still generally say 'cell'
- [22:58:45] <hober>
It's like the US telcom industry has adopted the 'mobile' terminology, but their customers haven't.
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- [23:21:44] <WPU>
I hope this gets sorted out.
- [23:22:39] <davecardwell>
it's mobile in UK, but most people would understand cell
- [23:27:07] <WPU>
I guess I'm just saying that there is a likely chance that the "cell" phones we are using will no longer be using cell/cellular/tower technology.
- [23:39:33] <kingryan>
WPU, that doesn't really matter IMO
- [23:39:47] <kingryan>
as long as people think of them as cell phones, the name's good enough
- [23:39:56] <KevinMarks>
well, they were called mobile first
- [23:40:12] <KevinMarks>
heck, they wer called carphones before that
- [23:40:27] <WPU>
yeah!
- [23:41:13] <WPU>
Again . . . I still believe mobile has the most universal and long-lasting appeal and should probably be the preferred language of future standards
- [23:41:33] <kingryan>
we're not going to change it in hcard, we're gonna stick with vcard
- [23:41:41] <kingryan>
terminology
- [23:41:51] <KevinMarks>
well, eventually I predict they'll be called 'phone' and 'landline' will be the special case
- [23:42:22] <WPU>
kingryan: I figured, I am just saying that new vcard versions should probably change cell to mobile.
- [23:42:31] <WPU>
KevinMarks: good point
- [23:42:40] <kingryan>
there won't be new vcard versions IMO
- [23:44:43] <yamico>
BTW: The new top level domain is .mobi, not .cell ...
- [23:46:13] <kingryan>
of course there's also .tel
- [23:46:15] <yamico>
BTW^2: That TLD sucks.
- [23:46:29] <pnhChris>
which will be obsolete before the name "cell" is
- [23:46:41] <pnhChris>
(mobi)
- [23:46:50] <kingryan>
tel is for "contact information", not just telephone stuffs
- [23:47:48] * pnhChris wants to run a new TLD:: .thatllbeanother20bucksplease
- [23:49:27] <pnhChris>
anyway.. i'm off for the night.. have a nice weekend
- [23:49:32] * pnhChris (n=cac6982@c-68-39-71-181.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) Quit ()
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