IRC Log for #microformats on 2006-03-31
Timestamps are in UTC.
- [00:01:03] <mfbot>
[[citation-irc-meetup]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=citation-irc-meetup&diff=0&oldid=5641 * Brian * (+108) things to discuss -
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- [00:16:43] <jibot>
karlUshi is karlcow
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- [01:40:23] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
- [01:40:28] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
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- [02:10:42] <jibot>
limbo_ is Eran and blogs at http://hellonline.com/blog/
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- [02:43:13] * tantek thinking of going to CTTP for a bit.
- [02:53:36] <KevinMarks>
cttp?
- [02:56:09] <KevinMarks>
does that involve food?
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- [03:00:31] <tantek>
yes
- [03:01:45] <KevinMarks>
what does CTTP stand for?
- [03:02:03] <tantek>
?def cttp
- [03:02:03] <jibot>
Nobody has defined cttp yet
- [03:02:12] <tantek>
?def cttp is Coffee To The People
- [03:02:12] <jibot>
cttp is Coffee To The People
- [03:02:16] <tantek>
?def CTTP
- [03:02:16] <jibot>
CTTP is Coffee To The People
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- [04:29:17] <jibot>
BenjaminCarlyle is http://soundadvice.id.au/blog/, GMT 1000
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- [04:56:12] <jibot>
bergie is lives in Finland and blogs at http://bergie.iki.fi/blog/ and Midgard CMS developer
- [05:01:21] <Frederic>
morning
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- [05:08:58] <mfbot>
[[citation-irc-meetup]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=citation-irc-meetup&diff=0&oldid=5642 * ZenPsycho * (+89) things to discuss -
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- [05:48:16] <jibot>
mlinksva is Mike Linksvayer and from Creative Commons
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- [07:57:08] <kirai>
/join #joito
- [07:57:22] <kirai>
/join #joiito
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- [10:18:26] <jibot>
bergie is lives in Finland and blogs at http://bergie.iki.fi/blog/ and Midgard CMS developer
- [10:43:44] * BenjaminCarlyle (n=fuzzy@c210-49-65-117.rochd2.qld.optusnet.com.au) Quit ("Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/")
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- [13:13:19] <jibot>
bergie is lives in Finland and blogs at http://bergie.iki.fi/blog/ and Midgard CMS developer
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- [14:28:59] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5643 * Jon Tan * (+313) Implementations -
- [14:29:30] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5644 * Jon Tan * (-1) Implementations -
- [14:44:12] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag&diff=0&oldid=5645 * Jon Tan * (+165) Implementations -
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- [14:45:03] <jibot>
dglazkov is Dimitri Glazkov (http://glazkov.com) and lives in Birmingham, AL, USA (-6:00 GMT)
- [14:49:56] <jonnay>
hi Dimitri
- [15:00:56] <dglazkov>
hey!
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- [15:51:35] <jibot>
pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
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- [16:43:16] <jibot>
mlinksva is Mike Linksvayer and from Creative Commons
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- [17:13:46] <jibot>
hober is Edward O'Connor and works for EVDB on http://eventful.com/ and lives in San Diego, CA (-08:00)
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- [17:27:27] <DanC>
irony... no machine-readable calendar info on http://www.calconnect.org/iopmay2006.html
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- [17:52:03] <mfbot>
[[rest/datatypes]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rest/datatypes&diff=0&oldid=5646 * DrErnie * (+159) Usage - clarify order independence
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- [18:32:12] * DanC waves
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- [18:34:32] <TantekC>
hello DanC
- [18:36:11] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5647 * Jon Hicks * (+82) Examples in the wild -
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- [18:38:03] <rohit>
Dan C, you here?
- [18:38:07] <DanC>
yup
- [18:38:11] <TantekC>
hey Rohit
- [18:38:25] <TantekC>
we're awaiting you on the telcon for Alex's podcast
- [18:38:28] <rohit>
the conf call system is fubar
- [18:38:37] <rohit>
maybe working now
- [18:38:37] <DanC>
oh? works-for-me
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- [18:38:43] <markp>
grr
- [18:38:58] <KevinMarks>
grr?
- [18:39:51] <rohit>
are we all on irc
- [18:40:01] <rohit>
will we use this to coordinate the "floor"?
- [18:40:09] <rohit>
(re: the concall some of us are on)
- [18:40:49] <TantekC>
we could at least record the questions here
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- [18:41:16] <TantekC>
the podcast will be public, therefore I'm sure there is no problem with recording the questions here
- [18:41:18] * DanC considers asking about the copyright license of the resulting audio
- [18:41:20] <rohit>
alex works at msft (4 yrs now)
- [18:41:29] <TantekC>
good q DanC
- [18:41:37] * TantekC prefers to CC-by license it
- [18:41:41] <rohit>
"data program availability" (sp?) ADO.net/odbc/etc
- [18:42:07] <rohit>
this is orthogonal to his pro interests, from his web-blogging interests
- [18:42:15] <DanC>
Alex: been working with web stuff since about 1994 (!)
- [18:43:04] <rohit>
CC-by 2.5 lic
- [18:43:55] * DanC gets up to speed... http://blogs.msdn.com/alexbarn
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- [18:44:07] <rohit>
http://www.netcrucible.com/blog/Microformats+++MIX.aspx
- [18:44:22] <rohit>
my six predictions on the topic:
- [18:44:22] <rohit>
2006 will be a hot year for microformats, but 2007 will be even hotter (am pointing to Chris as he was the first one to help me understand the significance - in a bar somewhere in San Francisco last year - thank you Chris).
- [18:44:27] <rohit>
Most Microsoftees will not have heard of microformats nor know what they are by the end of 2006. But those Microsoftees that need to know, will.
- [18:44:30] <rohit>
The OPML freaks will embrace microformats.
- [18:44:33] <rohit>
Those who said structured blogging wouldn't take off will come around as they realize that using microformats in blogs is structured blogging
- [18:44:33] <DanC>
http://blogs.msdn.com/alexbarn/archive/2006/03/25/560944.aspx My 6 predictions on microformats
- [18:44:36] <rohit>
Some people will say microformats won't take off, no matter what
- [18:44:39] <rohit>
New microformat-based business will blossom over the next two years
- [18:44:41] <rohit>
\me says where "me" == alex barnett
- [18:45:43] <rohit>
and here was the pre-show "agenda":
- [18:45:56] <rohit>
> Introductions
- [18:45:56] <rohit>
> Introductions to microformats - what are they, examples?
- [18:45:56] <rohit>
> Why should we care?
- [18:45:56] <rohit>
> Who's doing what today?
- [18:45:56] <rohit>
> Competing standards - fight or interop?
- [18:45:59] <rohit>
> Semantic Web or (s)emantic (w)eb
- [18:46:01] <rohit>
> What of the future? Where is all this going?
- [18:48:38] * TantekC gives his intro
- [18:48:44] <TantekC>
DanC gives his intro
- [18:49:29] * DanC cribbed from his linkedin bio, of all things... "Edited HTML 2.0 with Tim Berners Lee, participated in the development of the URI and HTTP specs with Roy Fielding; chaired working group on HTML 4.0 with Dave Raggett and CSS 1 with Hakon Lie, helped Jon Bosak form the XML working group and deliver that spec, working with Eric Miller to finish RDF and OWL and start the next thing. "
- [18:49:42] <DanC>
(wierd... no useful url. https://www.linkedin.com/profile?trk=tab_pro )
- [18:50:14] <rohit>
rk's claim to fame is knowing dan and tantek :)
- [18:50:39] * TantekC notes that Rohit also pushed us to make microformats.org happen.
- [18:50:46] <rohit>
"microformats are what you're already using"
- [18:51:00] <DanC>
I was pretty surprised when I found rohit in `whois microformats.org`
- [18:51:00] <rohit>
\bookmark -- definitely want to talk about Ozzie's liveClipboard later?
- [18:51:32] * DanC has been trying to get some of timbl's bandwidth to look at Ozzie's stuff
- [18:52:00] <rohit>
Adam Rifkin gets a lot of credit for "funding" µf.org too
- [18:52:57] * KevinMarks (n=Snak@pdpc/supporter/active/kevinmarks) Quit ("The computer fell asleep")
- [18:54:08] <rohit>
who is "we" ? -- great question
- [18:54:25] <rohit>
TÇ talking about kevin and the origins of µf
- [18:55:33] * TantekC refers to microformats.org to define the "we"
- [18:56:58] <rohit>
rk would like to say that civillians are in the "we"
- [18:57:02] <rohit>
which is a big deal
- [18:59:26] <TantekC>
TantekC: Alex asks the important question: Why would anyone bother?
- [19:00:12] <rohit>
can I step in?
- [19:00:22] <TantekC>
hold on a sec
- [19:00:26] <TantekC>
i've got a two parter answer to this one
- [19:00:49] <TantekC>
rohit, could you record the qs
- [19:01:00] <rohit>
"what is the killer app for µf"?
- [19:01:29] <rohit>
part 1: (TÇ): less work ; part 2: more benefit
- [19:01:51] <rohit>
less work for "designers"
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- [19:04:44] <TantekC>
less work for folks thinking up their own IA
- [19:04:49] <TantekC>
like a bunch of IA templates
- [19:05:44] <DanC>
q+ to note that microformats answers lingering who/what/where/when semweb questions, based on a community that groks cool urls, structured blogging
- [19:05:59] * IanJ (n=Ian@24-148-44-40.lem-bsr1.chi-lem.il.cable.rcn.com) has joined #microformats
- [19:06:13] <DanC>
yo ian. see /topic for log pointers
- [19:07:03] <DanC>
(I just converted two soccer schedules this week. one from HTML, one from PDF)
- [19:07:17] <TantekC>
DanC, awesome
- [19:07:28] <rohit>
benefits "for whom"
- [19:07:28] <DanC>
q+ q+ q+
- [19:07:47] <rohit>
Q: when will there be an aggregator (3rd-party) for soccer sheds
- [19:07:49] <rohit>
schedules
- [19:08:10] <rohit>
q: "Will i get a bigger audience, less phone calls"? what benefit"
- [19:08:18] <rohit>
Dan is to answer -- he IS a soccer dad
- [19:09:00] * TantekC notes that Rohit didn't make up the SoccerML example thinking of DanC in mind -- nice coincidence guys.
- [19:09:30] <rohit>
coincidence? Nice pass, more like it :)
- [19:10:54] <rohit>
\ps: tantek: our poster is hcard-marked up in the www conf proceedings: http://labs.commerce.net/~rohit/pp116-khare.xhtml
- [19:11:13] <rohit>
\rk would like to chip in
- [19:11:17] <DanC>
http://www.htgsports.net/scoring/Schedule.aspx?leagueID=53&division=103&team=1589
- [19:11:24] <TantekC>
q+
- [19:11:26] <rohit>
about how µf is about core types, not variants like soccer
- [19:12:15] <rohit>
TÇ interjects: all µfs start *from* real-world examples
- [19:13:00] <rohit>
\me wonders: is hixie on the call? or just in the #chan right now?
- [19:13:37] <TantekC>
Hixie is not on the call
- [19:13:54] <TantekC>
he declined to participate because he needed more time to work out the details of his participation.
- [19:14:00] <rohit>
no prob
- [19:14:07] <DanC>
hcard version of that soccer sched: http://dm93.org/2006geo/soccer_u10.html
- [19:14:14] <rohit>
\rk would really like to interject...
- [19:14:19] <rohit>
\rk raises hand :)
- [19:14:23] <rohit>
but dan is in q, no?
- [19:14:29] <DanC>
no, go ahead, rohit
- [19:14:39] <DanC>
hixie gave regrets
- [19:17:56] <TantekC>
Alex wants to touch on interop with other formats, e.g. RDF.
- [19:17:59] <rohit>
Qs: interop
- [19:18:04] * TantekC glances in DanC's direction. ;)
- [19:18:07] <rohit>
Q:s ozzie's demo
- [19:18:30] <rohit>
Q3: what do we mean by lowercase semweb
- [19:18:52] <rohit>
\rk would like to respond to AB's "predictions" post in conclusion :)
- [19:19:52] <rohit>
DC starts with a great parable of "XML could only have come after HTML" -- that RDF could be *too* generic
- [19:20:07] <rohit>
that there's a base-starting-point-problem of "where, who, when"
- [19:20:23] * dbaron (n=dbaron@gw.office.mozilla.org) has joined #microformats
- [19:20:25] <rohit>
"so that people don't have to write an encyclopedia every time they want to write a restaurant menu"
- [19:20:44] <rohit>
\rk would like to tackle the ozzie-demo Q
- [19:21:12] <TantekC>
Rohit, ozzie-demo q is all yours
- [19:21:20] <rohit>
so can tc take the lowercase q
- [19:21:22] <rohit>
?
- [19:21:27] <TantekC>
Rohit, go for it
- [19:21:40] * valmont (n=chrishol@germany.pspdev.pas.earthlink.net) has joined #microformats
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- [19:25:35] <jibot>
kingryan is ryan king
- [19:25:38] * ChanServ sets mode +o kingryan
- [19:25:47] <DanC>
why does RSS have to be part of that picture, rohit? why not just subscribe to the HTML in the 1st place?
- [19:25:51] <rohit>
rk went on about feeds-of-µf data
- [19:26:09] * DanC apologizes for asking rohit to have 2 conversations at once
- [19:26:12] * kingryan is listening in at t-rati
- [19:26:22] <DanC>
listening? this is real-time broacast?
- [19:26:27] <rohit>
\dan, good q. Probably has something to do with beating devs over the head with "rss == timeseries"
- [19:26:36] <rohit>
Q: provenance
- [19:26:46] <kingryan>
DanC, I'm sitting in the room with tantek
- [19:26:50] <DanC>
ah
- [19:28:32] * DanC wonders what it'll take to beat dumb polling http. is XMPP/jabber going to have a critical place? or some mulitcast thingy?
- [19:28:35] <rohit>
rk on provenance
- [19:29:19] <rohit>
maybe not -- RK despairs that since it's "all merely text" and network capacity is being driven by HD Video &c, it may never be "painful" enough to go to a more-scalable version. I'll keep working on it in the meantime, tho!
- [19:29:39] <rohit>
parochially, my bet is XMPP or streaming HTTP -- one of the two
- [19:29:54] <rohit>
key is which supports web programmers more "easily"
- [19:30:27] <rohit>
dan quoth: blogging got the world to really use "cool urls" and not-404
- [19:30:45] * DanC notes the time
- [19:30:53] <TantekC>
DanC, can you answer this one in 30s
- [19:30:57] <rohit>
deadline was 11:30, right?
- [19:31:02] <rohit>
ah, so
- [19:31:39] <TantekC>
Rohit, you've got 30s
- [19:31:48] <TantekC>
let's be sure to give pointers to more info
- [19:31:54] <TantekC>
and encourage folks to get involved in the community
- [19:31:56] <DanC>
I gave a 30 second answer, expecting him to wrap.
- [19:32:42] <TantekC>
Thanks DanC
- [19:33:04] <rohit>
sorry i dragged the wrapup. Can that get cut? :)
- [19:33:09] <rohit>
thanks fpr the wraup tc
- [19:33:47] <rohit>
\need more prep for such a zinger! :(
- [19:33:58] <rohit>
"predictions" not quite fair :)
- [19:34:01] * annevk (n=annevk@pat-tdc.opera.com) has joined #microformats
- [19:34:37] <dglazkov>
ooh cool, podcast orchestration
- [19:34:46] <kingryan>
backchannel :D
- [19:34:58] <dglazkov>
can that go with the podcast?
- [19:35:58] <rohit>
sure -- it's all out there for better or worse, right, mflogbot?
- [19:36:19] <rohit>
do we have to hang up now?
- [19:36:41] <TantekC>
hello annevk, welcome to the channel
- [19:36:56] <dglazkov>
this "openness" crap sure is scary :)
- [19:38:36] <rohit>
dan, got a sec, o u h time-constrained one?
- [19:38:45] <rohit>
"or were you"
- [19:38:52] <DanC>
huh?
- [19:39:02] <DanC>
I'm not in a huge rush, though I do have a writing assignment today
- [19:39:47] <rohit>
call on # ending in 76?
- [19:39:52] <rohit>
or -01?
- [19:40:10] <DanC>
the 0241 number, pls
- [19:40:36] <rohit>
shoot, don't have that in the db. Don't feel you have to put it in a public channel, tho!! hang on
- [19:40:40] <annevk>
hi TantekC
- [19:40:54] <DanC>
it's in the .sig of all my mail in this podcast thread
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- [20:38:02] <jibot>
briansuda is brian suda of X2V fame
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- [21:53:32] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5648 * Epersonae * (+117) Examples in the wild -
- [21:54:08] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5649 * Epersonae * (+15) Examples in the wild -
- [21:55:43] * pnhChris (n=cac6982@c-68-39-71-181.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) has joined #microformats
- [21:55:43] <jibot>
pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
- [22:07:24] <KevinMarks>
seen your page recently dan? http://www.w3.org/People/Connolly/
- [22:07:38] <KevinMarks>
(attack of the evil <plaintext> )
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- [23:06:11] <mfbot>
[[workofart-brainstorming]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=workofart-brainstorming&diff=0&oldid=5650 * TimG * (-2) Added response to Ryan Cannon's suggestion.
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