IRC Log for #microformats on 2006-11-26

Timestamps are in UTC.

  1. [00:04:01] * veeliam (n=veeliam@207.111.252.38) has joined #microformats
  2. [00:04:01] <jibot> veeliam is William Lawrence of Quiddities Dev out of Santa Cruz and he does something at http://zaxbypass.com and here and there
  3. [00:04:21] <veeliam> hello all! i've gots a question
  4. [00:05:26] <veeliam> when adding a link on a website to "download" my hcard with technorati, what's best, http://www.technorati.com/contacts/.... or http://feeds.technorati.com/contacts/.... ?
  5. [00:05:31] <veeliam> or is there a difference?
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  15. [02:22:08] <jibot> tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
  16. [02:56:37] <Token-> tantek Which is your earn in anual salary on technorath microformats developer?
  17. [02:56:51] <Token-> annual
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  24. [03:42:27] <veeliam> so, what's better, http://www.technorati.com/contacts/.... or http://feeds.technorati.com/contacts/.... ?
  25. [03:43:55] <factoryjoe> the former
  26. [03:44:46] <veeliam> without the "feeds", eh? goood.
  27. [03:45:27] <veeliam> but, why the difference? has there been a discussion about this somewhere?
  28. [03:47:05] <factoryjoe> it's a 'rati thing
  29. [03:47:14] <factoryjoe> they changed the url schema awhile back
  30. [03:47:17] <factoryjoe> i have no idea why
  31. [03:47:23] <factoryjoe> tantek or KevinMarks might have some clue
  32. [03:48:02] <tantek> no, for the transform it is still http://feeds.technorati.com/contacts/URLofPageWhCards
  33. [03:48:02] <factoryjoe> tantek: you around?
  34. [03:48:11] <factoryjoe> so what's the former for?
  35. [03:48:24] <tantek> of course if you "go there" without a URL it will direct you to the web interface
  36. [03:48:36] <tantek> one is the conversion service (feeds.)
  37. [03:48:45] <tantek> and the other is the web UI to the conversion service
  38. [03:48:49] <tantek> get it?
  39. [03:48:53] <factoryjoe> ah
  40. [03:48:56] <factoryjoe> understood
  41. [03:49:01] <factoryjoe> veeliam: there you go
  42. [03:49:02] <factoryjoe> so
  43. [03:49:04] <factoryjoe> tantek
  44. [03:49:07] <factoryjoe> got a moment?
  45. [03:49:10] <tantek> not really
  46. [03:49:28] <veeliam> ok, so for coding into the sites, it ought to be feeds, yes?
  47. [03:49:32] <tantek> yes
  48. [03:49:43] <factoryjoe> hmm
  49. [03:49:44] <factoryjoe> ok
  50. [03:49:46] <factoryjoe> i'll post to the list
  51. [03:49:48] <veeliam> thank you
  52. [03:49:58] <tantek> fj - might as well ask
  53. [03:50:03] <tantek> someone else might answer too ;)
  54. [03:50:03] <factoryjoe> ok
  55. [03:50:08] <factoryjoe> i took matters into my own hands
  56. [03:50:14] <tantek> plus asking here puts it in the archives
  57. [03:50:19] <tantek> in many ways as good as posting on the list
  58. [03:50:25] <tantek> except more efficient
  59. [03:50:27] <factoryjoe> it seemed silly that people wanted to split the mailing list into a forum
  60. [03:50:30] * tantek is really getting tired of email.
  61. [03:50:36] <tantek> yes it was silly
  62. [03:50:40] <factoryjoe> when really they wanted RSS + alternative views of the same data
  63. [03:50:43] <factoryjoe> so
  64. [03:50:44] <factoryjoe> http://groups-beta.google.com/group/microformats/
  65. [03:50:45] <tantek> totally thinking that tool-jerking would help
  66. [03:50:50] <tantek> that's so not the top level problem
  67. [03:50:55] <veeliam> i searched the mfbot before i asked here.
  68. [03:50:59] <tantek> it's pretty much a waste of time
  69. [03:51:01] <factoryjoe> anyway
  70. [03:51:04] <tantek> veeliam - np
  71. [03:51:05] <factoryjoe> i set up a google group
  72. [03:51:10] <factoryjoe> that sucks up mf-discuss
  73. [03:51:13] <factoryjoe> it's a mirror
  74. [03:51:17] <factoryjoe> it doesn't allow posting
  75. [03:51:27] <tantek> you just duplicated gmane.org
  76. [03:51:28] <factoryjoe> but it's got RSS, search and the features that forums provide
  77. [03:51:29] <tantek> for no good reason
  78. [03:51:30] <factoryjoe> sure
  79. [03:51:41] <factoryjoe> i prefer the UI of the google groups beta
  80. [03:51:47] <factoryjoe> is MF on gmane?
  81. [03:51:51] <tantek> you just reinvented instead of reused
  82. [03:51:53] <tantek> yes
  83. [03:51:55] <tantek> been there for ages
  84. [03:52:02] <factoryjoe> wasn't aware
  85. [03:52:05] <tantek> always assume something exists before you go off reinventing it
  86. [03:52:10] <tantek> search for it as if it exists
  87. [03:52:18] <tantek> only when you're fairly convinced it doesn't
  88. [03:52:21] <factoryjoe> i never heard anyone bring that up in the discussion
  89. [03:52:24] <tantek> then *ask* if anyone else knows it exists
  90. [03:52:27] <factoryjoe> well
  91. [03:52:28] <factoryjoe> whatever
  92. [03:52:31] <tantek> before going off an revinventing it
  93. [03:52:32] <factoryjoe> i opted for action this time
  94. [03:52:38] <factoryjoe> i didn't reinvent anything
  95. [03:52:39] <tantek> and then and only then go off and create it
  96. [03:52:42] <factoryjoe> i used a tool that's available to me
  97. [03:52:43] <tantek> and tell people you did
  98. [03:52:51] <tantek> you will do a lot less duplicate effort this way
  99. [03:52:59] <factoryjoe> even if i'm the only only who uses it, i'll get benefit out of it
  100. [03:53:26] <tantek> remember what happened with the pbwiki you setup instead of creating more pages on the microformats wiki?
  101. [03:53:37] <tantek> duplicated effort is nearly always a waste of time
  102. [03:53:47] <factoryjoe> i do
  103. [03:53:49] <factoryjoe> nothing
  104. [03:53:52] <tantek> this is all about your own efficiency
  105. [03:54:01] <tantek> up to you if you want to expend your time duplicating efforts of course
  106. [03:54:08] <factoryjoe> the MF wiki still has all the problems that I was concerned about then
  107. [03:54:11] <factoryjoe> except now it's worse
  108. [03:54:16] <tantek> but the point is your pbwiki did nothing to help it
  109. [03:54:16] <factoryjoe> that's right
  110. [03:54:19] <tantek> that's the point
  111. [03:54:24] <tantek> therefore creating it was a waste of time
  112. [03:54:27] <factoryjoe> hmm
  113. [03:54:38] <tantek> it's up to you how efficient you want to be
  114. [03:54:51] <factoryjoe> i suppose, in the totality of things i could have done, the effort used could have been used more productively
  115. [03:54:54] <tantek> i'm only here to help you be more efficient if you choose to be
  116. [03:54:57] <veeliam> it could have been that creating it was the only way for him to learn. no?
  117. [03:54:58] <factoryjoe> heh
  118. [03:55:01] <factoryjoe> yes master tantek
  119. [03:55:02] <tantek> but that choice is up to you
  120. [03:55:03] <factoryjoe> ;)
  121. [03:55:13] <factoryjoe> exactly
  122. [03:55:20] <factoryjoe> i need to make my own mistakes, you know
  123. [03:55:21] <tantek> veeliam - then it should take exactly one duplicate action to learn
  124. [03:55:25] <factoryjoe> that's the best way i learn
  125. [03:55:26] <tantek> rather than 2 ;)
  126. [03:55:30] <factoryjoe> heh
  127. [03:55:34] <factoryjoe> touché
  128. [03:55:36] <tantek> also
  129. [03:55:43] <tantek> learn from others' duplicate actions
  130. [03:55:48] <tantek> rather than having to do it yourself
  131. [03:55:49] <tantek> even once
  132. [03:55:50] <veeliam> but there are so many mediums to go through.
  133. [03:56:28] <tantek> no one needs to make their own mistakes, but most prefer to
  134. [03:56:39] <tantek> in this day an age of massive public documentation
  135. [03:56:48] <tantek> there are plenty of others' mistakes out there to learn from
  136. [03:56:51] <factoryjoe> i disagree
  137. [03:57:02] <factoryjoe> you're refuting the essence of education
  138. [03:57:17] <factoryjoe> surely you don't contend that you should believe everything that you're told or that you read
  139. [03:57:23] <tantek> you're right, education has not accounted for the disruption that is the web, search engines, realtime search, wikipedia etc.
  140. [03:57:24] <factoryjoe> mr OBEY
  141. [03:57:25] <veeliam> do as i say, and not as i do?
  142. [03:57:48] <tantek> the essence of education has already been refuted. education just hasn't realized it yet.
  143. [03:58:00] <factoryjoe> i'd prefer to be able to recall my own personal anecdotes about why something works than rely, always, on other's experiences
  144. [03:58:08] <tantek> you can learn faster and cheaper from others' mistakes than your own.
  145. [03:58:15] <factoryjoe> not as deeply
  146. [03:58:22] <tantek> err on the side of learning from others' mistakes
  147. [03:58:33] <tantek> because even then you'll (all of us) make plenty of your own, don't worry
  148. [03:58:41] <factoryjoe> i'll start there, but never settle for knowing completely on that basis
  149. [03:58:54] <factoryjoe> you're a matrix fan, you know i couldn't accept that line of thinking
  150. [03:58:58] <tantek> Esther Dyson says always make new mistakes
  151. [03:59:10] <tantek> I interpret that to mean new for the world, not just new for yourself
  152. [03:59:11] <factoryjoe> good advice, presuming there are new mistakes to malke
  153. [03:59:13] <factoryjoe> make
  154. [03:59:22] <tantek> there are always new mistakes to make
  155. [03:59:25] <factoryjoe> there are very few new mistakes to make
  156. [03:59:34] <tantek> there's lots of them
  157. [03:59:37] <factoryjoe> only foreign contexts and circumstances and societies
  158. [03:59:42] <tantek> but people seem to prefer repeating old mistakes
  159. [03:59:46] <tantek> c.f. history
  160. [03:59:46] <factoryjoe> they're *different*, rarely new
  161. [03:59:57] <factoryjoe> ironically
  162. [04:00:11] <factoryjoe> those who preach watching history sometimes get whacked in the face by the future
  163. [04:00:12] * tantek ducks factoryjoe's pedantic semantic trap.
  164. [04:00:18] <factoryjoe> heh
  165. [04:00:25] <factoryjoe> iraq <-->vietname
  166. [04:00:28] <factoryjoe> vietnam
  167. [04:00:34] <factoryjoe> same mistake? or new context?
  168. [04:00:45] <factoryjoe> new mistake? same ignorance?
  169. [04:00:57] <factoryjoe> smoking? alcohol?
  170. [04:00:59] <factoryjoe> etc
  171. [04:01:11] <factoryjoe> i guess that's when we quickly get into the discussions of morals
  172. [04:01:24] <factoryjoe> and what is, at base, "morally right" or "morally justifiable"
  173. [04:01:30] <factoryjoe> the true in truth
  174. [04:01:41] <factoryjoe> see? we've been having the same conversations since the grecian times
  175. [04:01:52] <factoryjoe> is what's true for you the same for me?
  176. [04:02:05] <factoryjoe> are the lessons you've learned from your mistakes the same lessons i'd learn or *should* learn?
  177. [04:02:21] <factoryjoe> wherein does free will come to bear?
  178. [04:02:50] <factoryjoe> where does individuality lie if we can learn all we need to know simply by following the logical mistake-paths of others?
  179. [04:02:57] <factoryjoe> .fin
  180. [04:04:22] <factoryjoe> wow -- speechless?
  181. [04:04:52] <veeliam> all i have to say, factoryjoe, is that both of you are right.
  182. [04:05:05] <veeliam> you've been arguing around in circles
  183. [04:05:23] <veeliam> the cynic and the optimist
  184. [04:05:30] <factoryjoe> indeed
  185. [04:05:36] <factoryjoe> it's the typical roles we take
  186. [04:05:39] <veeliam> take your pick
  187. [04:05:52] <factoryjoe> tantek is the ultimate pragmatist
  188. [04:06:20] <factoryjoe> our approach to things is exceptionally different
  189. [04:06:29] <factoryjoe> which is probably why we complement each other fairly well
  190. [04:07:06] <veeliam> as an outsider, i concur.
  191. [04:07:22] * tantek is not speechless - he GTD-filtered factoryjoe's pedantic semantic trap to /dev/null.
  192. [04:08:47] <veeliam> so tantek, do you deny that you and factoryjoe complement each other?
  193. [04:12:29] <factoryjoe> ah well, we've lost him
  194. [04:12:52] <factoryjoe> his loop was returning zero
  195. [04:12:58] <factoryjoe> his logic bailed on him
  196. [04:13:22] <veeliam> you about lost me too. i was just waiting to see the batch result
  197. [04:14:43] <factoryjoe> heh
  198. [04:14:52] <factoryjoe> oh well
  199. [04:14:57] * tantek (n=tantek@dsl001-150-252.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net) Quit ()
  200. [04:14:57] <factoryjoe> i was just rambling nonsense anyway
  201. [04:15:22] <veeliam> well, i hope the nonsense you rambled you believed.
  202. [04:15:29] <veeliam> if just a little.
  203. [04:16:43] <factoryjoe> i did
  204. [04:16:47] <factoryjoe> i almost always do
  205. [04:16:56] <factoryjoe> i have a hard time saying things i don't believe
  206. [04:17:07] <veeliam> good.
  207. [04:17:09] <factoryjoe> which gets me in trouble some times
  208. [04:17:10] <factoryjoe> ;)
  209. [04:18:15] <veeliam> so back on topic, if for just a little bit, what do you believe is the future of microformats?
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  211. [04:19:25] <veeliam> ignore that last question.
  212. [04:19:43] <veeliam> what i really want to know is the difference between hcard and vcard.
  213. [04:20:11] <factoryjoe> really?
  214. [04:20:18] <factoryjoe> those are two *very* different questions
  215. [04:20:31] <veeliam> really.
  216. [04:20:32] <veeliam> i know.
  217. [04:20:57] <veeliam> the first, former, question ought to be a no brainer.
  218. [04:21:14] <veeliam> the second question is me showing my ignorance.
  219. [04:23:09] <veeliam> never-mind again. i found the answer i was looking for.
  220. [04:25:32] <factoryjoe> heh
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  228. [05:23:38] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  229. [05:23:38] <jibot> tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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  231. [05:36:39] <jibot> Atamido is Paul Bryson, http://orangeman.commo.de/
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  336. [11:11:19] <mfbot> [[hcard-implementations]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-implementations&diff=0&oldid=10696 * EranS * (+98)
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  339. [12:05:02] <mfbot> [[rel-tag]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag&diff=0&oldid=10697 * EranS * (+167) Implementations -
  340. [12:07:08] <mfbot> [[rel-tag]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag&diff=0&oldid=10698 * EranS * (+0) Implementations -
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  343. [13:50:07] <mfbot> [[hatom]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom&diff=0&oldid=10699 * EranS * (+129) Implementations -
  344. [14:00:14] <mfbot> [[rel-tag-ja]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-ja&diff=0&oldid=10700 * IwaiMasaharu * (+167) sync: english: 12:07, 26 Nov 2006
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  349. [14:41:51] <mfbot> [[how-to-play-ja]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=how-to-play-ja&diff=0&oldid=10701 * IwaiMasaharu * (+12) How to Play - 表現の変更
  350. [14:43:52] <mfbot> [[Main Page-ja]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Main_Page-ja&diff=0&oldid=10702 * IwaiMasaharu * (+11) How to contribute -
  351. [14:48:18] <mfbot> [[hatom]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom&diff=0&oldid=10703 * EranS * (+47) Implementations -
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  396. [20:39:07] <mfbot> [[rel-tag-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-issues&diff=0&oldid=10704 * AndyMabbett * (+522) WCAG 13.6
  397. [20:39:58] <mfbot> [[rel-tag-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-issues&diff=0&oldid=10705 * AndyMabbett * (+0) WCAG 13.6
  398. [20:45:44] <mfbot> [[hatom]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom&diff=0&oldid=10706 * AndyMabbett * (+0) move Yedda from 'Implementations' to Examples i t Wild'
  399. [20:49:43] <julianstahnke> how do you mark up lists in the wiki?
  400. [20:51:15] <mfbot> [[hatom]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom&diff=0&oldid=10707 * AndyMabbett * (+535) Boilerplate; clarify headings
  401. [20:51:21] <mfbot> [[rel-tag]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag&diff=0&oldid=10708 * AndyMabbett * (+376) new 'Examples in the Wild' section
  402. [20:52:42] <mfbot> [[Talk:mars-examples-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Talk:mars-examples-fr * 1164573684 * (+1637)
  403. [20:53:33] <mfbot> [[Talk:hlisting-extended-examples-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Talk:hlisting-extended-examples-fr * 1164573738 * (+1637)
  404. [20:53:55] <mfbot> [[Talk:mars-examples-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Talk:mars-examples-fr&diff=0&oldid=10709 * AndyMabbett * (-1637) spam -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- !
  405. [20:54:11] <mfbot> [[Talk:picoformats]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Talk:picoformats * 1164573803 * (+1637)
  406. [20:54:27] <mfbot> [[BrianSuda]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/BrianSuda * 1164573803 * (+1637)
  407. [20:54:28] <mfbot> [[Talk:hlisting-extended-examples-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Talk:hlisting-extended-examples-fr&diff=0&oldid=10710 * AndyMabbett * (-1637) spam -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- !
  408. [20:54:34] <mfbot> [[Talk:adr-examples]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Talk:adr-examples * 1164573803 * (+1637)
  409. [20:54:55] <mfbot> [[BrianSuda]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=BrianSuda&diff=0&oldid=10711 * AndyMabbett * (-1637) spam -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- !
  410. [20:55:06] <mfbot> [[Talk:picoformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Talk:picoformats&diff=0&oldid=10712 * AndyMabbett * (-1637) spam -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- !
  411. [20:55:12] <mfbot> [[hcalendar-parsing]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/hcalendar-parsing * 1164573803 * (+1637)
  412. [20:55:13] <mfbot> [[DeanEro]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/DeanEro * 1164573866 * (+1637)
  413. [20:55:14] <mfbot> [[Talk:meeting-minutes-formats]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Talk:meeting-minutes-formats * 1164573866 * (+1637)
  414. [20:55:35] <mfbot> [[Talk:adr-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Talk:adr-examples&diff=0&oldid=10713 * AndyMabbett * (-1637) spam -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- !
  415. [20:56:01] <mfbot> [[Talk:meeting-minutes-formats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Talk:meeting-minutes-formats&diff=0&oldid=10714 * AndyMabbett * (-1637) spam -
  416. [20:56:07] <mfbot> [[Talk:xmdp-faq]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Talk:xmdp-faq * 1164573866 * (+1637)
  417. [20:56:18] <mfbot> [[DeanEro]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=DeanEro&diff=0&oldid=10715 * AndyMabbett * (-1637) - spam -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- !
  418. [20:56:29] <mfbot> [[hcalendar-parsing]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar-parsing&diff=0&oldid=10716 * AndyMabbett * (-1637) - spam -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- !
  419. [20:57:05] <mfbot> [[Talk:xmdp-faq]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Talk:xmdp-faq&diff=0&oldid=10717 * AndyMabbett * (-1637) - spam -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- !
  420. [20:58:11] <mfbot> [[DannyAyers]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/DannyAyers * 1164573930 * (+1637)
  421. [20:58:12] <mfbot> [[Talk:media-formats]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Talk:media-formats * 1164573930 * (+1637)
  422. [20:58:53] <mfbot> [[Talk:stock-symbol-examples]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Talk:stock-symbol-examples * 1164573930 * (+1637)
  423. [20:58:59] <mfbot> [[Talk:xfolk-profile]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Talk:xfolk-profile * 1164573930 * (+1637)
  424. [21:00:15] <mfbot> [[product]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/product * 1164573930 * (+1637)
  425. [21:01:01] <mfbot> [[product]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=product&diff=0&oldid=10718 * AndyMabbett * (-1637) - spam -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- !
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  430. [21:33:43] <mfbot> [[cheatsheet/hCard]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/cheatsheet/hCard * JulianStahnke * (+963)
  431. [21:34:14] <ajturner> if I use javascript to getElementById("adr1") - what's the easiest way to then get that elements children by class name (street-address, et al)?
  432. [21:35:44] <ajturner> is there a "programming examples" page on the mf wiki?
  433. [21:36:19] <mfbot> [[cheatsheet/hCard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cheatsheet/hCard&diff=0&oldid=10719 * JulianStahnke * (+100)
  434. [21:38:41] <mfbot> [[cheatsheet/hCard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cheatsheet/hCard&diff=0&oldid=10720 * JulianStahnke * (+8)
  435. [21:41:07] <mfbot> [[cheatsheet/hCard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cheatsheet/hCard&diff=0&oldid=10721 * JulianStahnke * (+176)
  436. [21:42:43] <mfbot> [[parsing-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=parsing-microformats&diff=0&oldid=10722 * AndrewTurner * (+343) Added getElementsByClassName example
  437. [21:44:51] <julianstahnke> how do I make an internal link to, for example, http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard-singular-properties#n in the wiki edit markup thing?
  438. [21:45:14] <mfbot> [[parsing-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=parsing-microformats&diff=0&oldid=10723 * AndrewTurner * (+9) JavaScript example -
  439. [21:45:18] <ajturner> [[pagename]
  440. [21:45:31] <ajturner> [[adr]]
  441. [21:45:42] <julianstahnke> but what if I want the text in the link to be different from the name of the page?
  442. [21:45:45] <mfbot> [[parsing-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=parsing-microformats&diff=0&oldid=10724 * AndrewTurner * (-9) JavaScript example -
  443. [21:46:05] <julianstahnke> hcard-singular-properties#n is not a great link text for what I want :(
  444. [21:46:52] <ajturner> [[adr | address]]
  445. [21:46:56] <ajturner> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:How_to_edit_a_page#Links_and_URLs
  446. [21:48:55] <julianstahnke> ah, thanks very much!
  447. [21:49:01] <ajturner> np
  448. [21:49:24] * veeliam (n=veeliam@207.111.252.38) has joined #microformats
  449. [21:52:30] * Phae (n=phae@80-41-171-60.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  450. [21:52:41] <mfbot> [[cheatsheet/hCard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cheatsheet/hCard&diff=0&oldid=10725 * JulianStahnke * (+279)
  451. [22:01:15] * tantek (n=tantek@adsl-63-195-114-133.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) has joined #microformats
  452. [22:01:16] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  453. [22:04:28] <mfbot> [[cheatsheet/hCard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cheatsheet/hCard&diff=0&oldid=10726 * JulianStahnke * (+693)
  454. [22:06:11] <julianstahnke> is there a list of what the hCard properties mean, other than the reference to RFC 2426 in the hCard Profile?
  455. [22:06:19] <tantek> hi julian
  456. [22:06:22] <julianstahnke> hello
  457. [22:06:38] <tantek> that's it currently
  458. [22:06:45] <tantek> btw - please keep wiki names lower case
  459. [22:06:55] <julianstahnke> oh, sorry!
  460. [22:06:59] <julianstahnke> how can I change that?
  461. [22:07:01] <tantek> http://microformats.org/wiki/naming-conventions
  462. [22:07:05] <tantek> i'll rename it now
  463. [22:07:17] <julianstahnke> ah, cheers
  464. [22:07:19] <tantek> oh and the other thing
  465. [22:07:37] <julianstahnke> yes?
  466. [22:07:44] <tantek> we should be avoiding hierarchies on the wiki, with two exceptions previous discussed (I need to add this to the naming-conventions page)
  467. [22:08:03] <tantek> since this is the hCard cheatsheet it should therefore be hcard-cheatsheet
  468. [22:08:12] * julianstahnke suddenly thinks he should have read all that before starting
  469. [22:08:25] <mfbot> [[cheatsheet/hCard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cheatsheet/hCard&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+2219) cheatsheet/hCard moved to hcard-cheatsheet
  470. [22:08:39] <julianstahnke> thanks
  471. [22:09:26] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+0) blocked "User:1164573930" with an expiry time of indefinite: spam
  472. [22:11:07] <mfbot> [[naming-conventions]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=naming-conventions&diff=0&oldid=10727 * Tantek * (+312) added rule about no hierarchy
  473. [22:11:08] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+0) blocked "User:1164573684" with an expiry time of indefinite: spam
  474. [22:11:14] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+0) blocked "User:1164573738" with an expiry time of indefinite: spam
  475. [22:11:20] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+0) blocked "User:1164573803" with an expiry time of indefinite: spam
  476. [22:11:21] <tantek> cheers julian
  477. [22:11:26] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+0) blocked "User:1164573866" with an expiry time of indefinite: spam
  478. [22:11:27] <mfbot> [[hcard-cheatsheet]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-cheatsheet&diff=0&oldid=10728 * JulianStahnke * (+58)
  479. [22:11:40] * tantek waits for RyanKing to clear the spam
  480. [22:12:06] * tantek (n=tantek@adsl-63-195-114-133.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) Quit ()
  481. [22:12:48] * tantek (n=tantek@adsl-63-195-114-133.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) has joined #microformats
  482. [22:13:10] * Ronnos (n=Ronnos@s5593d4e3.adsl.wanadoo.nl) Quit ("Chatzilla 0.9.76 [Firefox 2.0/2006101023]")
  483. [22:13:24] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  484. [22:13:40] <tantek> julian, thanks much for your help with the hCard cheatsheet
  485. [22:13:44] <julianstahnke> np
  486. [22:14:08] <mfbot> [[Template:hcard-related-pages]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:hcard-related-pages&diff=0&oldid=10729 * AndyMabbett * (+40) hcard-cheatsheet
  487. [22:14:24] <mfbot> [[Template:hcard-related-pages]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:hcard-related-pages&diff=0&oldid=10730 * AndyMabbett * (+2) []
  488. [22:14:35] <mfbot> [[Template:hcard-related-pages]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:hcard-related-pages&diff=0&oldid=10731 * AndyMabbett * (+0)
  489. [22:14:51] <julianstahnke> I just hope Brian Suda (if that's the guy who made the PDF cheat sheet) won't get angry at me for almost copying it ;)
  490. [22:15:01] <mfbot> [[hcard-cheatsheet]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-cheatsheet&diff=0&oldid=10732 * AndyMabbett * (+25) {{hcard-related-pages}}
  491. [22:15:37] <mfbot> [[hcard-cheatsheet]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-cheatsheet&diff=0&oldid=10733 * AndyMabbett * (+18) sub-head
  492. [22:16:58] <mfbot> [[hcard-cheatsheet]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-cheatsheet&diff=0&oldid=10734 * AndyMabbett * (+32) link
  493. [22:17:29] <mfbot> [[hcard-cheatsheet]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-cheatsheet&diff=0&oldid=10735 * AndyMabbett * (-3)
  494. [22:21:55] <mfbot> [[Template:hcard-related-pages]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:hcard-related-pages&diff=0&oldid=10736 * AndyMabbett * (-59) sort & copy edit
  495. [22:22:41] <mfbot> [[Template:hcard-related-pages]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:hcard-related-pages&diff=0&oldid=10737 * AndyMabbett * (+0) decap
  496. [22:25:42] <mfbot> [[hcard-cheatsheet]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-cheatsheet&diff=0&oldid=10738 * AndyMabbett * (+72) E.123
  497. [22:33:49] <mfbot> [[accessibility]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=accessibility&diff=0&oldid=10739 * AndyMabbett * (+862) Accessibility of this wiki
  498. [22:36:30] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "product": spam
  499. [22:36:36] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "Talk:xfolk-profile": spam
  500. [22:36:47] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "Talk:stock-symbol-examples": spam
  501. [22:36:58] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "Talk:media-formats": spam
  502. [22:37:04] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "DannyAyers": spam
  503. [22:37:10] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "Talk:xmdp-faq": spam
  504. [22:37:16] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "DeanEro": spam
  505. [22:37:22] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "hcalendar-parsing": spam
  506. [22:37:23] <mfbot> [[User talk:JulianStahnke]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/User_talk:JulianStahnke * AndyMabbett * (+446) Cheat Sheet
  507. [22:37:29] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "Talk:adr-examples": spam
  508. [22:37:35] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "BrianSuda": spam
  509. [22:37:46] <mfbot> [[accessibility]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=accessibility&diff=0&oldid=10740 * AndyMabbett * (+2) Accessibility of this wiki - []
  510. [22:37:47] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "Talk:picoformats": spam
  511. [22:37:58] <mfbot> [[User talk:JulianStahnke]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=User_talk:JulianStahnke&diff=0&oldid=10741 * AndyMabbett * (+1) []
  512. [22:38:12] * ryanlowe_ is now known as ryanlowe
  513. [22:38:59] <mfbot> [[User talk:JulianStahnke]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=User_talk:JulianStahnke&diff=0&oldid=10742 * AndyMabbett * (-52)
  514. [22:39:30] <mfbot> [[User talk:JulianStahnke]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=User_talk:JulianStahnke&diff=0&oldid=10743 * AndyMabbett * (+45) link
  515. [22:41:13] <tantek> julian, I think Brian will be fine with it
  516. [22:47:31] <mfbot> [[hcard-cheatsheet]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-cheatsheet&diff=0&oldid=10744 * AndyMabbett * (+44) sub-headings
  517. [22:48:37] <mfbot> [[adr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=adr&diff=0&oldid=10745 * AndyMabbett * (+37) (to make sense of link from hcard cheetsheet, etc.)
  518. [22:49:28] <mfbot> [[adr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=adr&diff=0&oldid=10746 * AndyMabbett * (+37) Examples in the wild - see also
  519. [22:50:48] <julianstahnke> AndyMabblet just raised the issue of accessibility because I used bold and italic text... is there any way to use colours in the wiki?
  520. [22:51:18] <tantek> no matter what styling you use there will be some accessibility issue raised
  521. [22:51:30] <tantek> so for now, just stick with replicating what Brian did with the cheatsheet
  522. [22:51:44] <tantek> that's the simple thing to do
  523. [22:52:07] <tantek> later if someone wants to make a more complicated/wordy version with extra stuff to make it more accessible, they can do that
  524. [22:52:45] <julianstahnke> okay
  525. [22:53:09] <tantek> we have a lot of work to do with microformats and we have to focus on the biggest wins first
  526. [22:53:35] <tantek> and document the smaller things to do along the way with the assumption that someone will get around to them eventually
  527. [22:53:57] <tantek> it's all a matter of prioritizing for maximum productivity/usefulness in minimum time
  528. [22:55:55] <mfbot> [[accessibility]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=accessibility&diff=0&oldid=10747 * JulianStahnke * (+409) Accessibility of this wiki -
  529. [22:57:40] <mfbot> [[Template:hcard-related-pages]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:hcard-related-pages&diff=0&oldid=10748 * AndyMabbett * (-41) more sorting & copy editing
  530. [22:58:06] <mfbot> [[accessibility]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=accessibility&diff=0&oldid=10749 * JulianStahnke * (+247) Accessibility of this wiki -
  531. [23:01:58] <mfbot> [[Template:hcalendar-related-pages]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:hcalendar-related-pages&diff=0&oldid=10750 * AndyMabbett * (-59) sort & copy edit
  532. [23:03:28] * charasky (n=fix_you@201.250.12.28) has joined #microformats
  533. [23:12:36] * csarven (i=nevrasc@modemcable081.169-202-24.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #microformats
  534. [23:13:35] * charasky (n=fix_you@201.250.12.28) has left #microformats
  535. [23:17:54] <mfbot> [[accessibility]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=accessibility&diff=0&oldid=10751 * AndyMabbett * (+193) Accessibility of this wiki - response
  536. [23:24:35] <mfbot> [[accessibility]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=accessibility&diff=0&oldid=10752 * AndyMabbett * (+179) Accessibility of this wiki -
  537. [23:26:11] <mfbot> [[accessibility]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=accessibility&diff=0&oldid=10753 * JulianStahnke * (+161) Accessibility of this wiki -
  538. [23:46:23] <mfbot> [[accessibility]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=accessibility&diff=0&oldid=10754 * Veeliam * (-3) Accessibility of this wiki -

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