IRC Log for #microformats on 2007-10-21
Timestamps are in UTC.
- [00:07:40] * jeffmcneil2 (n=jeffmcne@66.162.254.21) has joined #microformats
- [00:07:44] <jeffmcneil2>
Hi folks, I hacked a MediaWiki extension for class support in anchor tags... http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:ExtendAnchorTags
- [00:17:30] <mfbot>
[[user-interface]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=user-interface&diff=0&oldid=22739 * Tantek * (+836) added indicate presence section, reorganized mockups / screenshots inline
- [00:20:56] <mfbot>
[[user-interface]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=user-interface&diff=0&oldid=22740 * Tantek * (+4)
- [00:22:27] <mfbot>
[[mediawiki-mark-up-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=mediawiki-mark-up-issues&diff=0&oldid=22741 * JeffMcNeill * (+859) Various issues discussed and addressed.
- [00:34:48] <mfbot>
[[user-interface]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=user-interface&diff=0&oldid=22742 * Tantek * (-1)
- [00:41:49] <mfbot>
[[user-interface]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=user-interface&diff=0&oldid=22743 * Tantek * (+2) moved Hicks example to additional user interface, chose different image
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- [01:43:43] <bengold>
hola
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- [04:45:23] <jeffmcneill___>
Aloha folks, created the mediawiki extension http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:EnableAbbrTags
- [04:45:51] <jeffmcneill___>
This along with ExtendAnchorTags helps provide support for POSH and Microformats on the MediaWiki platform
- [04:47:11] <jeffmcneill___>
With these two, just replace all <abbr...></abbr> with <xabbr...></xabbr> and <a...></a> with <xa...></xa> and everything is good to go... woot!
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- [04:59:30] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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- [05:37:12] <bengold>
TACOS?
- [05:48:14] <jeffmcneill___>
tacos?
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- [06:32:33] <jibot>
iand is Ian Davis who blogs at http://iandavis.com/blog
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- [07:27:34] <bengold>
tacos rock
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- [07:49:03] <jibot>
bear is located near Philadelphia, PA and the build/release grunt for OSAF and an apprentice python hacker
- [07:51:40] <mfbot>
[[mediawiki-mark-up-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=mediawiki-mark-up-issues&diff=0&oldid=22744 * JeffMcNeill * (+173) added note of EnableAbbrTags mediawiki extension, some small typos corrected as well
- [07:52:26] <mfbot>
[[events/2007-10-05-fundamentos-web-microformats-workshop]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2007-10-05-fundamentos-web-microformats-workshop&diff=0&oldid=22745 * Tantek * (+320) added photos
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- [07:54:21] <jibot>
ddfreyne is Denis Defreyne and blogs at http://stoneship.org/.
- [07:54:22] <mfbot>
[[mediawiki-mark-up-issues]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=mediawiki-mark-up-issues&diff=0&oldid=22746 * JeffMcNeill * (+54) added contributors' section
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- [08:14:38] <mfbot>
[[mediawiki-mark-up-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=mediawiki-mark-up-issues&diff=0&oldid=22747 * JeffMcNeill * (+221) Address - not sure why/how this needs to be supported
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- [08:44:56] <mfbot>
[[citation-formats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=citation-formats&diff=0&oldid=22748 * JeffMcNeill * (+173) Wikipedia / MediaWiki - Changed to Wikimedia foundation projects, added wikitextrose, wikicat, wikicite
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- [10:46:38] <jibot>
briansuda is brian suda of http://suda.co.uk and is at (-0000 GMT) and is author of "Using Microformats" for O'Reilly [http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/microformats/]
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- [13:27:40] <jibot>
MattBowen is Matt Bowen and can be found online at http://m.odul.us
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- [14:13:49] <jibot>
ddfreyne is Denis Defreyne and blogs at http://stoneship.org/.
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- [14:25:35] <jibot>
blueace is Robert Gaal, some Dutch guy from http://wakoopa.com and http://53miles.com
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- [14:44:51] <jibot>
briansuda is brian suda of http://suda.co.uk and is at (-0000 GMT) and is author of "Using Microformats" for O'Reilly [http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/microformats/]
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- [15:56:38] <jibot>
csarven is Sarven Capadisli and can be found online at http://www.csarven.ca
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- [16:24:04] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
- [16:25:03] <Azathoth>
T3N Magazine is gonna publish an article about Microformats in it's next issue - http://t3n.yeebase.com/
- [16:25:12] <Azathoth>
(in german)
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- [16:39:48] <jibot>
ddfreyne is Denis Defreyne and blogs at http://stoneship.org/.
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- [17:29:57] <mfbot>
[[Talk:rest/forms-brainstorming]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/Talk:rest/forms-brainstorming * LuxZwp * (+13896)
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- [17:49:50] <jibot>
briansuda is brian suda of http://suda.co.uk and is at (-0000 GMT) and is author of "Using Microformats" for O'Reilly [http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/microformats/]
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- [18:50:58] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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- [18:52:19] <tantek>
greetings
- [18:52:21] <tantek>
adactio and I are brainstorming solutions to the "representative hCard on the page" problem, and the "definitive hCard for a person on a site" problem
- [18:52:28] <tantek>
it appears that "uid" solves the latter
- [18:53:17] <mfbot>
[[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) blocked "User:LuxZwp" with an expiry time of infinite: spam
- [18:53:28] <mfbot>
[[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) deleted "Talk:rest/forms-brainstorming": spam
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- [18:57:43] * ChanServ sets mode +o adactio
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- [19:11:51] <tantek>
for the former we have some brainstorms but I think we need to collect more examples: http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard-brainstorming#Representative_hCard_discovery
- [19:12:37] * KevinMarks (n=KevinMar@c-98-207-134-151.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #microformats
- [19:21:55] <mfbot>
[[semantic XHTML]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/semantic_XHTML * Tantek * (+28)
- [19:24:26] <mfbot>
[[semantic xhtml]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/semantic_xhtml * Tantek * (+28)
- [19:24:53] <tantek>
hello KevinMarks
- [19:25:52] <mfbot>
[[implement]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=implement&diff=0&oldid=22749 * Tantek * (+21) noted [[get started]] page, added link to higher level [[semantic XHTML]] page
- [19:27:13] <mfbot>
[[get started]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/get_started * Tantek * (+25)
- [19:28:54] <mfbot>
[[getting started]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/getting_started * Tantek * (+25)
- [19:37:35] <mfbot>
[[screencasts]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=screencasts&diff=0&oldid=22750 * Adactio * (+513) this year -
- [19:44:51] <KevinMarks>
hello
- [19:46:52] <mfbot>
[[get-started]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=get-started&diff=0&oldid=22751 * Tantek * (+1602) moved some content from [[getting-started]] by MarkRickerby to new introduction section
- [19:48:32] <tantek>
Kevinmarks, adactio and I are brainstorming solutions to the "representative hCard on the page" problem, and the "definitive hCard for a person on a site" problem
- [19:54:23] <mfbot>
[[screencasts]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=screencasts&diff=0&oldid=22752 * Adactio * (+131) this year -
- [19:55:46] <KevinMarks>
oh, http://maps.google.com/maps/me to add your profile to maps
- [19:55:59] <mfbot>
[[hcard-authoring]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-authoring&diff=0&oldid=22753 * Tantek * (+2952) moved 5 minute primer by MarkRickerby from [[getting-started]] page to here
- [19:56:54] <KevinMarks>
I think the url = current page is good, especially with a url=uid
- [19:57:15] <KevinMarks>
uid as cue for local definitiveness
- [19:57:30] <mfbot>
[[getting-started]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=getting-started&diff=0&oldid=22754 * Tantek * (-5047) move some material to [[get-started]], redirect to [[get-started]], move intro hCard authoring material to [[hcard-authoring]]
- [19:58:06] <tantek>
agreed
- [19:58:35] <KevinMarks>
you are less keen on <address> as a cue?
- [19:59:49] <tantek>
yes
- [19:59:54] <tantek>
for two reasons
- [20:00:04] <tantek>
it doesn't semantically mean "representative person"
- [20:00:19] <tantek>
2. <address> semantics are *widely* confused by people
- [20:00:29] <tantek>
BTW KevinMarks - add the maps profile stuff to implementors/implementations pages: http://microformats.org/wiki/implementors#Google
- [20:04:20] <bengold>
are they really micro?
- [20:05:26] <mfbot>
[[implementations]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=implementations&diff=0&oldid=22755 * Kevin Marks * (+258) Google Maps -
- [20:05:51] <tantek>
bengold are what really micro?
- [20:05:59] <bengold>
formats
- [20:06:16] <tantek>
have you seen how big most data formats are?
- [20:07:48] <bengold>
I don't know a ruby on a rail from an african diamond
- [20:08:44] <tantek>
bengold - go to http://w3.org/TR/ and see how massive the specs are for anything to do with X*** (e.g. XML Schema *), and RDF ***, and even SVG, then come back and re-ask that question. ;)
- [20:09:45] <tantek>
KevinMarks, could you provide a sample profile URL for Google Maps profiles? Even better - instructions on how to *find* your profile URL on Google Maps?
- [20:10:09] <bengold>
This isn't #wordpress
- [20:10:34] <tantek>
correct, this is #microformats :)
- [20:10:58] <bengold>
true
- [20:11:16] <bengold>
maybe I should got to #oauth
- [20:11:23] <tantek>
that's a good place too
- [20:13:39] <KevinMarks>
the first link does that
- [20:14:19] <KevinMarks>
http://maps.google.com/maps/me redirects to yours (If logged into google)
- [20:14:24] <bengold>
The real reason I hooks up my 56k modem was to go to #rubyonrails to figure out an issue I'm having with a blogging softwarz
- [20:14:54] <tantek>
KevinMarks, but can you give me a URL for *your* profile that I can view without logging in?
- [20:15:27] <KevinMarks>
ah
- [20:16:07] <KevinMarks>
http://maps.google.com/maps/user?uid=109581870574956225297
- [20:16:17] <KevinMarks>
and yes, I know that uid is ugly
- [20:16:31] <KevinMarks>
working on enabling something better
- [20:19:57] <bengold>
geez that technorati thing sure is lame
- [20:21:11] <KevinMarks>
which technorati thing in particular?
- [20:21:22] <bengold>
the whole
- [20:21:46] <KevinMarks>
well, feel free to go and implement something better
- [20:21:46] <bengold>
.... I'm kidding, it's a fine fine site
- [20:22:59] <bengold>
I plan to make my own though. it's gonna be called Yahoo Blog Leaderboard
- [20:23:35] <bengold>
updated hourly by Jerry
- [20:32:17] * ddfreyne (n=ddfreyne@unaffiliated/ddfreyne) Quit ("Read error: illiterate user")
- [20:38:18] <tantek>
bengold re:technorati, if your feedback is not microformat related, consider giving it in #technorati instead. thanks!
- [20:41:28] <tantek>
KevinMarks, there is no hCard nor any use of XFN rel values on http://maps.google.com/maps/user?uid=109581870574956225297 - I did a view source.
- [20:41:49] * JMulder (n=me@ip4da10ac9.direct-adsl.nl) Quit ()
- [20:43:39] <mfbot>
[[events]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events&diff=0&oldid=22756 * Adactio * (+114) Upcoming -
- [20:45:13] <tantek>
it appears that the actual hCard and rel="me" are in a nested frame (deja vu) : http://maps.google.com/maps/c/widgets/ProfileViewer?js=RAW&maximize=true&hide=false&width=40&noTitle=true&theme=theme_2&service=local&uid=109581870574956225297&height=0&background=transparent&serverbased=true&border=NONE&eventCallback=ParentStub1192999211538&zx=dc574o15j0wrv
- [20:45:33] <tantek>
how's that for an ugly profile URL?
- [20:48:01] <tantek>
KevinMarks, that makes that profile URL (the link you posted) next to useless as no consumer (parser) will find any hCard at that URL, nor is there any indication that a parser should look inside the embedded frame.
- [20:50:10] <mfbot>
[[implementations]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=implementations&diff=0&oldid=22757 * Tantek * (+597) Google Maps - note actual profile URL, has no hCard nor XFN rel="me", note embedded frame
- [20:50:56] <mfbot>
[[events/2007-11-06-microfomats-a-web-of-data]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/events/2007-11-06-microfomats-a-web-of-data * Adactio * (+1939)
- [20:52:40] <tantek>
KevinMarks, in fact, the only embedded frame on that profile page is an iframe with no src: <iframe class=gbard id=gbarif style=border:0;z-index:999></iframe>
- [20:53:26] <tantek>
thus no consumer/crawler/parser has *any* chance at finding the embedded frame and thus the hCard
- [20:54:42] <mfbot>
[[events/2007-11-07-microfomats-nanotechonology]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/events/2007-11-07-microfomats-nanotechonology * Adactio * (+1892)
- [20:55:15] <tantek>
this embedded iframe technique doesn't make any sense, why not embed the content inline on the server side so that clients can detect/parse the hCard+XFN rather than using an iframe which is slower for browsers (causes another HTTP request), as well as an iframe which has its src presumably set by a javascript and thus impossible to crawl without inspecting/executing some javascript?
- [20:57:33] <mfbot>
[[events]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events&diff=0&oldid=22758 * Adactio * (-12) Upcoming -
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- [20:57:35] <jibot>
gsnedders is a mad teenager from Scotland who occasionally blogs at <http://geoffers.uni.cc/>
- [20:59:40] <tantek>
btw Google AFAIK is the only site that currently uses this needlessly complex dynamically embedded iframe technique for a user profile - every other site seems to be able to do such embedding server-side, thus making it easier on more clients everywhere. why can't Google?
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- [21:42:21] <mfbot>
[[hcard-design-methodology]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard-design-methodology * Tantek * (+5426) drafted
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[[rfc-2426]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rfc-2426&diff=0&oldid=22759 * Tantek * (+6)
- [21:44:48] <mfbot>
[[vCard]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=vCard&diff=0&oldid=22760 * Tantek * (+3)
- [21:45:19] <mfbot>
[[icalendar]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/icalendar * Tantek * (+22)
- [21:47:10] <mfbot>
[[rfc-2445]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/rfc-2445 * Tantek * (+764) drafted
- [21:47:46] <mfbot>
[[iCalendar]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/iCalendar * Tantek * (+22)
- [21:48:57] <mfbot>
[[ical]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=ical&diff=0&oldid=22761 * Tantek * (-1)
- [21:50:48] <mfbot>
[[iCal]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=iCal&diff=0&oldid=22762 * Tantek * (-1)
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- [21:52:34] <mfbot>
[[rfc-2445]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rfc-2445&diff=0&oldid=22763 * Tantek * (+64)
- [21:55:51] <mfbot>
[[mediawiki-customization]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=mediawiki-customization&diff=0&oldid=22764 * JeffMcNeill * (+388) How to - added two to-do items for MediaWiki customization of microformats.org/wiki
- [22:00:02] <mfbot>
[[semantic-xhtml-design-principles]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=semantic-xhtml-design-principles&diff=0&oldid=22765 * Tantek * (+318) added reference to [[hcard-design-methodology]] context
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[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=22766 * Tantek * (+6) moved semantic XHTML design principles and aded link to [[hcard-design-methodology]] in its place
- [22:11:19] <mfbot>
[[hcard-design-methodology]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-design-methodology&diff=0&oldid=22767 * Tantek * (-146)
- [22:11:50] <mfbot>
[[semantic-xhtml-design-principles]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=semantic-xhtml-design-principles&diff=0&oldid=22768 * Tantek * (-2250) use templated for semantic-xhtml-design-principles
- [22:14:51] <mfbot>
[[get-started-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=get-started-fr&diff=0&oldid=22769 * ChristopheDucamp * (+3942) sync'd
- [22:15:07] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=22770 * Tantek * (+4)
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[[Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles&diff=0&oldid=22771 * Tantek * (+327) add note to read [[hcard-design-methodology|hCard design methodology]] to understand context
- [22:20:55] <mfbot>
[[semantic-xhtml-design-principles]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=semantic-xhtml-design-principles&diff=0&oldid=22772 * Tantek * (-320) moved context prolog into the template
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[[semantic-xhtml]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=semantic-xhtml&diff=0&oldid=22773 * Tantek * (+7)
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[[user-interface-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=user-interface-fr&diff=0&oldid=22774 * ChristopheDucamp * (-343) [sync in progress]
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[[user-interface-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=user-interface-fr&diff=0&oldid=22775 * ChristopheDucamp * (+278) sync'd
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[[user-interface-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=user-interface-fr&diff=0&oldid=22776 * ChristopheDucamp * (-8)
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[[hcard-user-interface-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-user-interface-fr&diff=0&oldid=22777 * ChristopheDucamp * (+1942)
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[[geo-brainstorming-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=geo-brainstorming-fr&diff=0&oldid=22778 * ChristopheDucamp * (+21) sync'd
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[[hcard-authoring-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-authoring-fr&diff=0&oldid=22779 * ChristopheDucamp * (+3291) sync'd
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[[hcard-design-methodology-fr]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard-design-methodology-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+5583) [fr: sync'd and translation to be achieved]
- [23:20:36] <mfbot>
[[vCard-fr]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/vCard-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+25) #REDIRECT [[rfc-2426-fr]]
- [23:21:07] <mfbot>
[[rfc-2426-fr]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/rfc-2426-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+21) Traduire [[rfc-2426]]
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[[rfc-2426-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rfc-2426-fr&diff=0&oldid=22780 * ChristopheDucamp * (+787) translated
- [23:26:04] <mfbot>
[[semantic XHTML-fr]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/semantic_XHTML-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+31) #redirect [[semantic-xhtml-fr]]
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[[semantic-xhtml-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=semantic-xhtml-fr&diff=0&oldid=22781 * ChristopheDucamp * (-795) sync'd
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[[implementations-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=implementations-fr&diff=0&oldid=22782 * ChristopheDucamp * (+1185) Google Maps - sync'd
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[[Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles-fr&diff=0&oldid=22783 * ChristopheDucamp * (+390) sync'd
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[[Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles-fr&diff=0&oldid=22784 * ChristopheDucamp * (+2)
- [23:58:30] <mfbot>
[[hcard-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-fr&diff=0&oldid=22785 * ChristopheDucamp * (+145) sync'd
- [23:59:06] <mfbot>
[[hcard-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-fr&diff=0&oldid=22786 * ChristopheDucamp * (-17) typo
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