IRC Log for #microformats on 2009-10-13

Timestamps are in UTC.

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  5. [00:30:28] <CloCkWeRX> hey mkaply, woo re new operator release. unfortunately, I can't get http://products.freebaseapps.com/view?id=/en/amethyst_aura_barbie to parse the rdfa (and i have no idea how to go about debugging)
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  30. [03:26:52] <Atamido> Ooh, the Operator add-on for Firefox just got some good updating.
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  119. [21:09:58] <mkaply> This isn't valid, right?
  120. [21:10:03] <mkaply> <SPAN title="2010-03-03T20:3000" class="value-title dtstart">08:30pm (Wed)</SPAN>
  121. [21:10:10] <mkaply> the values and value-titles have to be children of the dtstart
  122. [21:10:20] <singpolyma> Right
  123. [21:10:39] <singpolyma> <span class="dtstart><span class="value-title> </span> Stuff</span>
  124. [21:11:16] <mkaply> that's what I thought
  125. [21:11:44] <mkaply> <span class="dtstart><SPAN title="2010-03-03T20:3000" class="value-title">08:30pm (Wed)</SPAN></span> would be ok too, right?
  126. [21:12:18] <singpolyma> I don't think so
  127. [21:12:30] <singpolyma> I think it must contain exactly one whitespace character, according to current spec
  128. [21:12:35] <mkaply> ah. ok
  129. [21:13:46] <mkaply> interesting. In the example on http://microformats.org/wiki/value-excerption-value-title-test#hCal.231:_An_hCalendar_dtstart , the span is empty
  130. [21:14:53] <singpolyma> Hmm. I thought that was not allowed, although there has been some mailing list discussion about that recently
  131. [21:15:19] <tobyink> The original plan was for them to be empty.
  132. [21:15:44] <tobyink> But someone pointed out that tidy strips out empty elements, so the plan was changed for them to contain a space character.
  133. [21:16:11] <tobyink> But now someone's pointed out that tidy still strips them out.
  134. [21:16:30] <mkaply> great. What was the reason for not allowing them to contain text?
  135. [21:16:34] <mkaply> like my second example?
  136. [21:17:10] <tobyink> To avoid the tooltip from being visible at all. (Which seems at odds with microformats visibility principles.)
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  138. [21:18:59] <mkaply> do all browsers display the title of a span as the tooltip?
  139. [21:19:32] <tobyink> All graphical browsers with significant market share on the desktop.
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  144. [21:44:52] <danbri> why not just fix/improve tidy?
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  146. [21:45:54] <tobyink> Someone has written a patch (Ben Ward?) but the fix hasn't been incorporated into the main distribution.
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  168. [23:36:40] <benward> tobyink danbri mkaply: To clarify regarding value-class-pattern
  169. [23:37:07] <benward> The single whitespace char/empty span thing is only for the use case where the author/publisher explicitly does not want to expose the data.
  170. [23:37:17] <benward> value-title is valid with other inner text too
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  172. [23:38:10] <benward> So: <span class="dtstart><SPAN title="2010-03-03T20:3000" class="value-title">08:30pm (Wed)</SPAN></span> is valid, and parses as "2010-03-03T20:3000". It will also expose a tooltip, but that is the author's perogative.
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These logs were automatically created by mflogbot on chat.freenode.net using a modified version of the Java IRC LogBot.

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