IRC Log for #microformats on 2006-02-26
Timestamps are in UTC.
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- [00:58:46] <TantekC>
hey Robert
- [00:58:54] <TantekC>
looks like pastebin can't handle UTF-8 :(
- [00:59:04] <TantekC>
it corrupted letters in my name and H�kon's name to begin with.
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- [01:03:26] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
- [01:03:44] <RobertBachmann>
hrm.
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- [01:08:45] <hober>
tantek: how does lisppaste fare? http://paste.lisp.org/
- [01:09:00] <RobertBachmann>
should work now http://uf.pastebin.com/pastebin.php?diff=572654
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- [01:35:55] <TantekC>
yes, much better
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- [01:40:21] <TantekC>
alright, i'll add some hCalendar
- [01:43:26] <RobertBachmann>
I've already tried to do so
- [01:44:42] <RobertBachmann>
http://uf.pastebin.com/pastebin.php?diff=572705 (DisclaimeR: I've never used hCalendar)
- [01:45:15] <RobertBachmann>
I've only added summary, description and dtstart.
- [01:54:03] <TantekC>
oh ok, i'll take a look
- [01:54:19] <TantekC>
it's ok if you haven't done it before, best way to learn is to start!
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- [02:19:52] <jibot>
andyhume is Andrew D. Hume and blogs at http://thedredge.org/ and has a wonderful use of hCards for commenters (see http://thedredge.org/2005/06/using-hcards-in-your-blog/ for details)
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- [03:17:30] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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amanuel is Amanuel, the social ambassador at http://otavo.com
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- [07:05:26] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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- [07:45:08] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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- [07:50:09] <tantek>
RobertBachmann (when you come back), here is my iteration on your addition of hCard and hCalendar to the W3C Technical Plenary page schedule: http://tantek.com/microformats/2006/03-01-TechPlenAgenda.html
- [07:54:34] <tantek>
it works well with X2V for both the hCards and hCalendar events
- [07:55:12] <tantek>
though the interesting thing is, there are some issues with the same person having multiple vcards in the same file with some addressbook programs. i will document on the wiki
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- [08:04:09] <mfbot>
[[User:Steve Ganz]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=User:Steve_Ganz&diff=0&oldid=5175 * Steve Ganz * (+13)
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- [08:14:35] <mfbot>
[[vcard-implementations]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=vcard-implementations&diff=0&oldid=5176 * Tantek * (+521) noted that Apple Address Book adds same person multiple times from a .vcf file
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- [11:35:29] <jibot>
andyhume is Andrew D. Hume and blogs at http://thedredge.org/ and has a wonderful use of hCards for commenters (see http://thedredge.org/2005/06/using-hcards-in-your-blog/ for details)
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- [11:53:25] <jibot>
BenjaminCarlyle is http://soundadvice.id.au/blog/, GMT 1000
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- [13:44:45] <jibot>
bkdelong is B.K. DeLong, Head Research Analyst for HALO Worldwide - http://www.haloworldwide.com. Web: http://www.brain-stream.com. Email: bkdelong@pobox.com and lives in Salem, MA, USA (-5:00 GMT)
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- [15:53:03] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5177 * Tantek * (+378) added Attending section with some folks. please addd yourself if attending!
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- [16:19:01] <jibot>
andyhume is Andrew D. Hume and blogs at http://thedredge.org/ and has a wonderful use of hCards for commenters (see http://thedredge.org/2005/06/using-hcards-in-your-blog/ for details)
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- [16:27:22] <jibot>
pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
- [16:31:05] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5178 * Tantek * (+41)
- [16:33:46] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-01-w3c-plenary-microformats]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-01-w3c-plenary-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5179 * Tantek * (+245)
- [16:35:47] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5180 * Tantek * (+238)
- [16:36:28] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar&diff=0&oldid=5181 * Tantek * (+238) New Examples -
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- [17:30:50] <tantek>
Thanks to RobertBachmann for helpin��Ͱt with adding hCard and hCalendar markup to W3C TP Agenda page.
- [17:31:18] <tantek>
here is the page with hCard and hCalendar if anyone wants to try importing it and see what they get: http://tantek.com/microformats/2006/03-01-TechPlenAgenda.html
- [17:31:42] <tantek>
is anyone around who can help with adding hCard and hCalendar to the O'Reilly ETech pages?
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- [17:51:51] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5182 * Tantek * (+1126) found ETech schedule, and they have some hCalendar! but it needs some work too.
- [17:53:04] <tantek>
I've collected the list of specific pages/URLs on the ETech 2006 site that need updating with hCalendar (fixes) or hCard (additions), please take a look and see if you can take a page and help mark it up: http://microformats.org/wiki/events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats#To_Do
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- [18:06:00] <jibot>
RobertBachmann is Robert Bachmann <http://rbach.priv.at/> and lives in Austria (Timezone: 01:00)
- [18:06:09] * tantek sets mode +o RobertBachmann
- [18:06:28] <tantek>
Hi Robert, take a look at my iteration on your markup: http://tantek.com/microformats/2006/03-01-TechPlenAgenda.html
- [18:07:05] * valmont (n=chrishol@pdpc/supporter/silver/valmont) Quit ()
- [18:08:38] * RobertBachmann has a look
- [18:13:59] <tantek>
and when you have a chance, take a look at some of the ETech pages that need some hCard too: http://microformats.org/wiki/events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats#To_Do
- [18:15:40] <RobertBachmann>
I'll start with <http://conferences.oreillynet.com/pub/w/43/program.html>
- [18:16:01] <tantek>
I'd stay start with the hCard only pages for now
- [18:16:09] <RobertBachmann>
ok
- [18:16:17] <tantek>
because it looks like they've added hCalendar support to the event pages, modulo a few bugs
- [18:16:36] <tantek>
and I have a feeling that all they need to do is tweak one or two places in their CMS to fix that
- [18:16:45] <tantek>
but AFAIK, there are no hCards on the pages
- [18:16:48] <tantek>
so those would be very helpful
- [18:16:59] <RobertBachmann>
ok so I'll start with http://conferences.oreillynet.com/pub/w/43/invite.html
- [18:17:07] <tantek>
awesome
- [18:17:49] <tantek>
in the process of iterating on your markup of the W3C page, I realized there are a bunch of "rules of thumb" for adding hCard markup to existing content that I really need to write up on the wiki
- [18:18:02] <tantek>
did you notice some of the changes I made?
- [18:19:16] <RobertBachmann>
Yes ... I'm currently comparing the two pages in WinMerge.
- [18:20:45] <tantek>
that page is a good sample for discussion about what to markup with which hCard property and why
- [18:21:14] <tantek>
because in many cases it was not obvious and took some thinking/consideration of what would work best among several alternatives
- [18:23:38] <mfbot>
[[hcard-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-examples&diff=0&oldid=5183 * RobertBachmann * (+5) hCard examples - Changed "=" to <h1>
- [18:26:33] <RobertBachmann>
I noticed you never used vCards role.
- [18:34:13] <RobertBachmann>
argl. invalid html
- [18:38:39] <tantek>
the challenge with role is what does it really mean or supposed to be used for?
- [18:38:49] <tantek>
according to RFC 2426 sec. 3.5.2
- [18:39:03] <tantek>
it is based on the X.520 Business Category explanatory attributge
- [18:39:06] <tantek>
attribute even
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- [18:39:37] <tantek>
that seems to imply a specific taxonomy, for which I have been unable to find definitive documentation
- [18:39:59] <tantek>
and the only example given in that section is ROLE:Programmer
- [18:40:37] <tantek>
from that, role seems very generic, something much more general than a job title in particular
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- [18:53:05] <mfbot>
[[hatom]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom&diff=0&oldid=5184 * RobertBachmann * (-22) Implementations - hAtom2Atom - new link
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- [19:06:26] <mfbot>
[[hatom]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom&diff=0&oldid=5185 * RobertBachmann * (+108) Examples in the wild -
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- [19:24:08] * RobertBachmann (n=RobertBa@N138P031.adsl.highway.telekom.at) has joined #microformats
- [19:24:13] <RobertBachmann>
http://conferences.oreillynet.com/pub/w/43/invite.html -> http://uf.pastebin.com/pastebin.php?diff=573658
- [19:36:55] <TantekC>
that looks pretty good
- [19:37:01] <TantekC>
a few things
- [19:37:14] <TantekC>
the class name for the phone is "tel" not "phone"
- [19:38:04] <TantekC>
and finally, hCards for orgs need both "fn" and "org" class names on their names
- [19:38:07] <TantekC>
e.g. this: <span class="org">O'Reilly Media, Inc.</span>
- [19:38:14] <TantekC>
should be: <span class="fn org">O'Reilly Media, Inc.</span>
- [19:38:31] <TantekC>
try making those changes and then running the results through http://feeds.technorati.com/contacts/
- [19:42:44] * TheMaecenati (n=TheMaece@adsl-71-132-212-69.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) has joined #microformats
- [19:51:08] * RobertBachmann (n=RobertBa@N138P031.adsl.highway.telekom.at) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
- [20:08:19] * RobertBachmann (n=RobertBa@M2461P010.adsl.highway.telekom.at) has joined #microformats
- [20:08:19] <jibot>
RobertBachmann is Robert Bachmann <http://rbach.priv.at/> and lives in Austria (Timezone: 01:00)
- [20:12:42] * tantek sets mode +o RobertBachmann
- [20:12:57] <tantek>
hi again Robert. did you get my previous suggested improvements for invite.html?
- [20:14:04] <RobertBachmann>
yes, -> http://uf.pastebin.com/pastebin.php?diff=573723
- [20:14:59] <RobertBachmann>
you can use http://uf.pastebin.com/pastebin.php?dl=573723 with http://feeds.technorati.com/contact/
- [20:24:04] <mfbot>
[[citation-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=citation-examples&diff=0&oldid=5186 * Tim White * (+12) Contributors -
- [20:25:40] <tantek>
looking good Robert.
- [20:25:53] <tantek>
I just noticed one more thing, which may or may not be worth fixing, but it is worth a shot
- [20:26:13] <tantek>
both 'contacts' that you just changed on invite.html have email addresses generated by javascript
- [20:26:40] <tantek>
both could be modified to also output class="email"
- [20:27:48] * andyhume (n=andyhume@82-69-100-15.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) has joined #microformats
- [20:27:49] <jibot>
andyhume is Andrew D. Hume and blogs at http://thedredge.org/ and has a wonderful use of hCards for commenters (see http://thedredge.org/2005/06/using-hcards-in-your-blog/ for details)
- [20:32:31] * trovster (n=tr-vs73r@blakesheen.demon.co.uk) has joined #microformats
- [20:32:31] <jibot>
trovster is a web developer from the UK who writes on http://www.trovster.com and runs www.csslounge.co.uk
- [20:34:56] <mfbot>
[[hreview-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hreview-issues&diff=0&oldid=5187 * PigsOTWing * (+274) default range -
- [20:36:05] * keithalexander (n=keithale@87.112.1.228.bbplus.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net) has joined #microformats
- [20:37:07] <mfbot>
[[citation-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=citation-examples&diff=0&oldid=5188 * Tim White * (+27609)
- [20:45:12] * keithalexander (n=keithale@87.112.1.228.bbplus.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net) Quit ()
- [20:46:35] <RobertBachmann>
I'll change the javascripts. I've added some hcards to http://conferences.oreillynet.com/pub/w/43/speakers.html
- [20:46:35] <RobertBachmann>
-> http://uf.pastebin.com/pastebin.php?diff=573790
- [20:48:00] <RobertBachmann>
seems like that text is to long for pastebin
- [20:55:23] <mfbot>
[[citation-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=citation-examples&diff=0&oldid=5189 * Mike * (+1224)
- [21:09:48] * blake (n=blake@dsl093-240-087.ral1.dsl.speakeasy.net) has joined #microformats
- [21:09:49] <jibot>
blake is allegedly human. Blake, also known as Cortland M. Setlow, studies at swarthmore.edu and enjoys building things, exploring buildings, and physics. He currently sleeps during the day.
- [21:12:15] <mfbot>
[[hreview-issues]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hreview-issues&diff=0&oldid=5190 * Tantek * (+234) PigsOTWing, please RTFM.
- [21:13:52] <Jonnay>
Err, how do you add a description of yourself to jibot? is it just a ?learn ?
- [21:14:02] <RobertBachmann>
yes
- [21:14:11] <Jonnay>
Thanks.
- [21:15:28] <RobertBachmann>
Tantek, here's invite.html with class="email" added to the JS generated content. http://rbach.priv.at/repos/misc/microformatting/ETech2006/invite.html
- [21:15:55] <tantek>
odd, your server is serving it as text/plain
- [21:16:26] <mfbot>
[[citation-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=citation-examples&diff=0&oldid=5191 * Tim White * (+1507)
- [21:16:28] <RobertBachmann>
yes, it servered by mod_svn ...
- [21:16:41] <RobertBachmann>
which serves everything as text/plain
- [21:17:03] <tantek>
ah
- [21:17:03] <RobertBachmann>
by default
- [21:17:22] <tantek>
btw, anyone know who PigsOTWing is?
- [21:17:50] <Jonnay>
Not i.
- [21:17:55] * tantek is less and less convinced of the utility of letting people use non-real names for wiki logins.
- [21:19:25] <Jonnay>
?def jonnay a programmer, artist, musician, and father. Jonnay is the developer of Meditation, a REST API Framework for PHP.
- [21:19:25] <jibot>
jonnay a programmer, artist, musician, and father. Jonnay is the developer of Meditation, a REST API Framework for PHP.
- [21:20:06] * RobertBachmann just loves svn
- [21:20:25] <Jonnay>
Mmm. SVN is like mana from heaven.
- [21:20:40] <RobertBachmann>
I've found about svn:mime-type. Now the files should be served as text/html
- [21:20:41] <tantek>
Robert, this is looking very good.
- [21:20:44] <Jonnay>
tantek: Agreed. I am a big fan of RealNamesOnlyPlease...
- [21:22:07] <tantek>
Robert, you could make the "For media-related..." line into an hCard in invite.html
- [21:22:34] <tantek>
ooh, and it looks like the org fn bit got reverted too
- [21:22:37] <tantek>
i'm seeing: <span class="org">O'Reilly Media, Inc.</span>
- [21:24:17] <tantek>
which should be <span class="org fn">O'Reilly Media, Inc.</span> near the bottom of the page
- [21:31:06] <RobertBachmann>
fixed both
- [21:33:16] <tantek>
oh, BTW, I realized that the "email" in the javascript *will* make a difference - to Magicline, and any other DOM based microformats parsers/extractors
- [21:33:32] <tantek>
e.g. I bet the Tails extension to Firefox will pick it up as well
- [21:34:36] <tantek>
Robert, this is looking really good.
- [21:34:53] <tantek>
Stick a <base href=".."> tag in there that points to the original document and all the images and styles should show up nicely.
- [21:35:32] <tantek>
Hi Jonnay, welcome to the channel. Have you been around here much?
- [21:37:16] * bear_afk is now known as bear
- [21:37:19] * trovster (n=tr-vs73r@blakesheen.demon.co.uk) Quit ()
- [21:38:00] <Jonnay>
Not really no. Just found out about microformats on friday, starting to play with them a little on my portfolio site.
- [21:39:11] <tantek>
ah very good. definitely ask here if you have any questions.
- [21:39:56] <Jonnay>
'm really interested in the REST<->microformats combination.. particularly AHAH
- [21:40:18] <RobertBachmann>
add <base>
- [21:40:22] <tantek>
yes, AHAH has gotten quite a bit good reception
- [21:40:30] <RobertBachmann>
added*
- [21:41:20] <Jonnay>
Everything just seems so blindingly... obvious.
- [21:41:38] * izo_ (n=izo@boi59-1-82-66-128-84.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #microformats
- [21:42:39] <Jonnay>
or rather blindingly obvious after someone does the work of figuring it out.
- [21:46:28] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5192 * Tantek * (+317) noted which pages need hCards. RobertBachmann has completed invite.html
- [21:47:28] <tantek>
nicely done Robert, I think invite.html is good to go. With those changes/edits in mind could you take a look at the remaining "Need hCards" pages? I'd say leave speakers for last since it is the biggest (unless you can figure out some clear global search and replace actions that make it quick -- that's how I managed to markup 107 speakers for the Web 2.0 conference this past October)
- [21:48:28] <tantek>
Jonnay, indeed. It's amazing how the *lack* of something can be an innovation. E.g. simplification and reduction can be provide incredible benefits, without being obvious at first.
- [21:52:45] <RobertBachmann>
ok, I'll pick the next one.
- [21:52:54] <tantek>
Robert, having now tested your invite.html with X2V
- [21:53:03] <tantek>
I noticed just *one more* thing that could help
- [21:53:10] <RobertBachmann>
yes?
- [21:53:16] <tantek>
for the contacts at the bottom
- [21:53:24] <tantek>
perhaps put their "purpose" into a <span class="note">
- [21:53:26] <tantek>
e.g.
- [21:54:00] <tantek>
right now it has: For media sponsor opportunities, contact <span class="fn">Margi Levin</span>
- [21:54:14] <tantek>
and all you get is Margi's name in the address book
- [21:54:17] <tantek>
it might help to have
- [21:54:23] <tantek>
<span class="note">For media sponsor opportunities, contact <span class="fn">Margi Levin</span> </span>
- [21:54:46] <tantek>
That way you at least know *why* this person was added from the page.
- [21:55:35] * tantek trying to squeeze the last bits of context/details out of the page. ;)
- [21:56:10] <tantek>
same for For sponsorship opportunities, and For media-related inquiries
- [21:56:49] <RobertBachmann>
done
- [21:57:59] <RobertBachmann>
next one: <http://conferences.oreillynet.com/pub/w/43/register.html> ?
- [21:58:05] <tantek>
yes, makes sense
- [21:58:08] <tantek>
testing ...
- [21:59:02] <tantek>
yep. invite.html works great.
- [21:59:34] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5193 * Tantek * (+37)
- [22:00:25] * LTjake (n=brian@CPE0011506c8049-CM0013711405ec.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #microformats
- [22:20:32] <RobertBachmann>
fax: 1-2-3 becomes <span class="tel"><span class="type">fax</span>: 1-2-3</span>?
- [22:21:36] <tantek>
yes, or more explicitly, you can use class="value"
- [22:21:37] <tantek>
e.g.
- [22:21:51] <tantek>
<span class="tel"><span class="type">fax</span>: <span class="value">1-2-3</span></span>
- [22:21:59] <tantek>
in order to avoid having the ":" show up in the phone number
- [22:56:51] <tantek>
hey Jonnay, still here?
- [22:57:35] <tantek>
if you have found REST/microformats/ AHAH useful, please consider going to the SXSW People's Choice awards site and voting for microformats: https://secure.sxsw.com/peoples_choice/
- [23:13:08] <RobertBachmann>
http://rbach.priv.at/repos/misc/microformatting/ETech2006/register.html
- [23:14:37] <tantek>
reviewing...
- [23:16:34] <tantek>
too bad about their misuse of the <address> element.
- [23:16:51] <tantek>
but you are right to not change it, we're trying to make minimal changes
- [23:19:28] <RobertBachmann>
g2g
- [23:19:33] <RobertBachmann>
bye
- [23:19:34] <tantek>
thanks Robert!
- [23:19:35] * RobertBachmann (n=RobertBa@M2461P010.adsl.highway.telekom.at) Quit ("Leaving")
- [23:21:51] * blake (n=blake@dsl093-240-087.ral1.dsl.speakeasy.net) Quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
- [23:22:32] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5194 * Tantek * (+113) RobertBachmann has added hCard to register.html
- [23:32:03] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-07-etech-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5195 * Tantek * (+193)
- [23:32:26] <tantek>
anybody else here want to try their hands at adding hCard markup to some existing O'Reilly ETech conference pages?
- [23:32:30] <tantek>
it would be a big help
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