IRC Log for #microformats on 2006-03-13
Timestamps are in UTC.
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- [00:02:46] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar&diff=0&oldid=5383 * Tantek * (+175) Examples in the wild -
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- [00:25:04] <rohit__>
grr. Colloquy 2.0 2D16 has been crashing routinely for me since ETech... no more than 20-30 min at a time (!). it's up to date, but I'm running 10.4.4. Any hints?
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- [02:34:53] <ptufts>
I've never been to sxsw. Could someone explain to me what's cool / interesting about it?
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- [04:14:45] <jibot>
pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
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- [05:39:41] <jibot>
bergie is lives in Finland and blogs at http://bergie.iki.fi/blog/ and Midgard CMS developer
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- [06:55:59] <jibot>
Enric is a media Software Developer and Videoblogger located at http://www.cirne.com
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- [07:55:29] <jibot>
bergie is lives in Finland and blogs at http://bergie.iki.fi/blog/ and Midgard CMS developer
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- [16:28:44] <tantek>
hmm... looks like hCard markedup SXSW speakers page is missing a couple of fn properties
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- [16:33:57] <briansuda>
Tantek: do you want to give this link a try http://suda.co.uk/projects/X2V/examples/sxsw06.html
- [16:41:25] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5384 * Tantek * (+187) noted problems with speakers.html page.
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- [16:57:45] <tantek>
brian, i'm fixing it now
- [16:58:12] <tantek>
lots of three word fns needing to be marked up with explicit n markup
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- [16:58:43] <briansuda>
for my link, or the speaker's page?
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- [17:00:39] <pnhChris>
that seems to be a definite hurdle / extra level of complexity for templating
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- [17:01:39] <tantek>
speakers page
- [17:01:50] <tantek>
here is the updated version: http://tantek.com/microformats/2006/sxsw/interactive/speakers.html
- [17:01:56] <tantek>
with more fn/n markup etc.
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- [17:05:07] <pnhChris>
i'd almost think it be worth spending some effort on a few constructs to examine 'name' fields .. but fear it would be wrong too often between multiple word nicknames and other hangups
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- [17:06:47] <tantek>
pnhChris, I added a suggestion for interpreting 3 word fns to the hcard-issues page
- [17:06:58] <tantek>
on the wiki
- [17:07:02] <tantek>
take a look and see what you think
- [17:07:03] * pnhChris nods
- [17:07:06] <pnhChris>
i'll have to look yeah
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- [17:10:27] <pnhChris>
but you have a situation like in wordpress where it stores usename, first name, last name and 'nickname" and, lets the user then set on of 6 or 7 different ways their name can be displayed in a blog post... so its not just the template that you have to get hcard info into, but much deeper into the logic (or soemplace in the middle.. i haven't looked at the code behind the display selection yet)
- [17:12:12] <pnhChris>
or the opposite problem in textpattern where you just have a single "real name" field and a "login" field.. and peopel use the "rela name" field for anything they'd like.. their real name or some complex nickname
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- [17:13:19] <pnhChris>
(this hits the use of hcard in other formats more directly then it does standalone hcards with some explicit logic behind them for maintaining contact info)
- [17:18:26] <cgriego>
T-12:00 to SXSWi presentation
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- [17:19:02] * DanC_AUS wonders if he's met cgriego
- [17:19:36] * DanC_AUS works on an hCalendar timezone idea
- [17:20:02] <cgriego>
I only know that we discussed a sxsw wiki, where are you at right now?
- [17:20:04] <pnhChris>
there's the added difficulty of "bad data" in those fields such as "Smith, Jr." in the last name field
- [17:20:30] <pnhChris>
due to only 2 fields being avaiable in the current interface
- [17:20:54] <DanC_AUS>
I'm in the µf panel room; at the front left, by the power plugs
- [17:21:27] <cgriego>
very corner?
- [17:21:38] <pnhChris>
wonder how many people at sxsw chat with each other online while sitting a seat or two from each other and not know it
- [17:21:47] <pnhChris>
silly intorweb
- [17:22:03] <DanC_AUS>
not quite very corner. 2 rows back
- [17:22:24] <cgriego>
I'm about 7 rows back, right against the wall
- [17:23:10] <pnhChris>
everyone at sxsw raise your hand (or don't.. i'm not there to see anyway)
- [17:23:17] <cgriego>
I'm sitting here because of the plug too, is there one available there? it would be a better view
- [17:23:25] <DanC_AUS>
and where do you live in cyberspace, cgriego
- [17:23:27] <DanC_AUS>
?
- [17:23:43] <cgriego>
off the cybergrid
- [17:24:44] <cgriego>
danc_aus: is there a powerplug available over there?
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- [17:25:07] <DanC_AUS>
yes, right in front of me
- [17:25:19] <cgriego>
sweet
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- [17:34:33] * DanC_AUS tries to think of something that'll crack tantek up ;-)
- [17:35:12] <DanC_AUS>
hmm... BY logo got messed up
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- [17:42:49] <cks>
shout-out from tantek at sxswi...
- [17:43:19] <DanC_AUS>
what exactly does "the microformats tag" mean? does that mean "the microformats tag at technorati"?
- [17:43:23] <savetheclocktowr>
prepare for avalanche
- [17:43:33] <savetheclocktowr>
DanC_AUS: yes
- [17:43:55] <savetheclocktowr>
<a rel="tag" href="whatev">microformats</a>
- [17:44:02] * DanC_AUS grumbles at the implication that technorati is the center of the universe
- [17:44:16] <DanC_AUS>
really, savetheclocktowr ? href="whatev"? it doesn't matter what URI goes there?
- [17:44:43] <savetheclocktowr>
DanC_AUS: right, because it can link to your blog category
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- [17:44:50] * ChanServ sets mode +o kingryan
- [17:44:58] <savetheclocktowr>
technorati just indexes the link text on all <a rel="tag">s
- [17:45:15] <DanC_AUS>
seriously? the URI is ignored?
- [17:45:30] <kingryan>
no, we use the uri
- [17:45:31] <KevinMarks>
false, savetheclocktowr
- [17:45:34] <kingryan>
not the link text
- [17:45:39] <savetheclocktowr>
i stand corrected
- [17:45:44] <KevinMarks>
we use the last path component of the url
- [17:45:56] <savetheclocktowr>
ah, there you go
- [17:46:08] <KevinMarks>
we're not the centre of the universe
- [17:46:17] <KevinMarks>
we just collect stuff from lots of the edges of it
- [17:46:26] <DanC_AUS>
hmm... so "the microformats tag" doesn't refer to "the microformats tag at technorati" but "any .../microformats tag"
- [17:46:27] <savetheclocktowr>
you don't have to make an explicit link to tag something... you can attach it to an existing link, like a blog category
- [17:46:43] <pnhChris>
but i do still find the implications on rel=tag odd...
- [17:46:50] <KevinMarks>
how so?
- [17:46:53] <savetheclocktowr>
DanC_AUS: it means "use the tag microformat to tag your blog post 'microformat'"
- [17:46:57] <savetheclocktowr>
meta enough for you?
- [17:47:13] <pnhChris>
given that its stuppsoed to point to a specific tag 'cloud' but that information is almost universally ignored
- [17:47:19] <DanC_AUS>
well, using a delicious tag would work too, yes?
- [17:47:25] <pnhChris>
wow.. i can't type
- [17:47:30] <KevinMarks>
yes
- [17:47:39] <KevinMarks>
or a flickr one or a Wikiepdia one
- [17:47:53] <pnhChris>
or magnolia, or an internal reference
- [17:48:18] <pnhChris>
but but how often is that interpreted as "a wikipedia tag"
- [17:48:20] <savetheclocktowr>
and as long as technorati crawls that page, or its corresponding feed, it'll pick up that tag
- [17:48:54] <KevinMarks>
well, we store the link url, but we don't distinguish in indexing or display at the moment
- [17:49:22] <KevinMarks>
the point is the link should help express the meaning fo the tag
- [17:49:25] <DanC_AUS>
"last path segment of the URI" is an interesting thing to index. hmm. hmm.
- [17:49:37] <pnhChris>
does anyone? what are the implications given most of the time people pick an arbitrary (or favorite) destination anyways?
- [17:49:55] <KevinMarks>
if you use a generic tagspace like tehcnorati, it means you are open to consensus definition
- [17:50:21] <KevinMarks>
if you pick your own category archive, you indicate you have a more personal view
- [17:50:39] <DanC_AUS>
consensus... quite. you're delegating to "the wisdom of crowds"
- [17:50:41] <pnhChris>
that's a helluva implication
- [17:51:19] <pnhChris>
... which begs my other question.. why isn't there a way to explicitly state its a consensus or genericly defined tag
- [17:51:22] <pnhChris>
;)
- [17:51:37] <KevinMarks>
because one way is sufficient
- [17:51:41] * DanC_AUS can't imagine how to me more explicit
- [17:51:52] <savetheclocktowr>
pnhChris: because those aren't mutually exclusive categories
- [17:51:58] <savetheclocktowr>
nor are they objective
- [17:51:58] <pnhChris>
is there a list somewhere that differentiates the "consensus" based clouds with specific clouds?
- [17:52:12] <kingryan>
someone have the URL of the review page norm used?
- [17:52:26] <DanC_AUS>
the other parts of the URI tell you whose defintion of the tag you're buying into
- [17:52:55] * DanC_AUS has been noodling on filling in lat/long from other hCard fields
- [17:53:11] * DanC_AUS is bummed that he missed the mapping panel
- [17:53:19] <pnhChris>
anyway.. this goes back to my hatom questions on feed categories and there not being a good way to map keywords/tags that might not be represented as links to generic namespaces... which there doesn't seem to be a good resolution to
- [17:53:37] <qid>
DanC_AUS: that would be called "geocoding" I belive
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- [17:55:00] <savetheclocktowr>
DanC_AUS: and the Y! geocoding API is freaking awesome
- [17:57:02] * DanC_AUS wishes for a 4 hour time stoppage in which to hack with the Y! geocoding API
- [17:57:14] <savetheclocktowr>
DanC_AUS: srsly
- [17:57:30] * kingryan (n=kingryan@198.214.235.18) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
- [17:57:33] <savetheclocktowr>
you can pass it a string with as much or as little location info as you please
- [17:57:37] <savetheclocktowr>
and it'll return a lat and lon
- [17:59:08] <DanC_AUS>
er... yeah, what's the benefit of adding class="xoxo"?
- [17:59:24] <KevinMarks>
a hint to parsers
- [17:59:30] <DanC_AUS>
to which parsers?
- [17:59:51] <KevinMarks>
pareses looking for lists of things
- [17:59:55] <DanC_AUS>
I use xoxo for my gtd-style projects list; combined with some .css and .js to animate it, it's kinda cool.
- [18:00:09] <KevinMarks>
cool
- [18:00:17] <DanC_AUS>
like what parsers looking for lists of strings? especially which ones that don't find <ul> by itself sufficient
- [18:00:30] <KevinMarks>
add it to the implementations section if it's public
- [18:00:52] <KevinMarks>
well, it makes thta kind of CSS-fu easier if you have other kinds of lists around too
- [18:01:45] * izo (n=izo@boi59-1-82-66-128-84.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #microformats
- [18:01:59] <DanC_AUS>
I mostly adapted existing stuff from the implementations section
- [18:02:31] <savetheclocktowr>
right, not all lists are outlines
- [18:02:44] <DanC_AUS>
the "url" field in vCalendar and hCalendar is such a tease; you want to add not just the person's homepage, but *also* a link to the sxsw panel info page
- [18:04:15] <TantekC>
http://tantek.com/presentations/2006/03/microformats-sxsw/
- [18:07:16] <DanC_AUS>
where does the "tails" name come from, I wonder
- [18:08:11] <cgriego>
I was just wondering that
- [18:08:18] * sketchyd (i=sketchyd@pool-71-250-176-38.nwrknj.east.verizon.net) has joined #microformats
- [18:09:06] <briansuda>
http://blog.codeeg.com/tails-firefox-extension
- [18:10:53] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5385 * ChristopherStJohn * (+42) Attending -
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- [18:26:09] * DanC_AUS wonders when the big push for hAtom should start
- [18:27:35] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5386 * Lucian * (+35) Attending -
- [18:28:00] * briansuda (n=briansud@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
- [18:28:42] <pnhChris>
what are there in terms of consumers out there now.. anything new?
- [18:29:01] * pnhChris checks the wiki again
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- [18:30:18] <pnhChris>
nope.. nothing since i've last been
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- [18:38:31] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5387 * EdwardOConnor * (-13) Examples - s/evdb/eventful/
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- [18:53:53] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5388 * DanielMorrison * (+131) Examples in the wild -
- [18:55:44] <mfbot>
[[events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5389 * Schaapy * (+40) Attending -
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- [19:25:01] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5390 * GatorDavid * (+72) New Examples -
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- [20:54:30] <amanuel>
so who is going to sxsw
- [20:58:22] <amanuel>
link to tails extension is broken on http://microformats.org/blog/2006/03/13/microformats-at-sxsw/
- [20:58:30] <amanuel>
http:// is missing
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