IRC Log for #microformats on 2006-03-13

Timestamps are in UTC.

  1. [00:02:19] * briansuda (n=briansud@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  2. [00:02:46] <mfbot> [[hcalendar]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar&diff=0&oldid=5383 * Tantek * (+175) Examples in the wild -
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  12. [00:25:04] <rohit__> grr. Colloquy 2.0 2D16 has been crashing routinely for me since ETech... no more than 20-30 min at a time (!). it's up to date, but I'm running 10.4.4. Any hints?
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  21. [02:34:53] <ptufts> I've never been to sxsw. Could someone explain to me what's cool / interesting about it?
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  39. [04:14:45] <jibot> pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
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  48. [05:39:41] <jibot> bergie is lives in Finland and blogs at http://bergie.iki.fi/blog/ and Midgard CMS developer
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  63. [06:55:59] <jibot> Enric is a media Software Developer and Videoblogger located at http://www.cirne.com
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  69. [07:55:29] <jibot> bergie is lives in Finland and blogs at http://bergie.iki.fi/blog/ and Midgard CMS developer
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  157. [16:28:44] <tantek> hmm... looks like hCard markedup SXSW speakers page is missing a couple of fn properties
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  160. [16:33:57] <briansuda> Tantek: do you want to give this link a try http://suda.co.uk/projects/X2V/examples/sxsw06.html
  161. [16:41:25] <mfbot> [[events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5384 * Tantek * (+187) noted problems with speakers.html page.
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  173. [16:57:45] <tantek> brian, i'm fixing it now
  174. [16:58:12] <tantek> lots of three word fns needing to be marked up with explicit n markup
  175. [16:58:31] * valmont (n=chrishol@pdpc/supporter/silver/valmont) Quit ()
  176. [16:58:43] <briansuda> for my link, or the speaker's page?
  177. [17:00:14] * briansuda (n=briansud@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  178. [17:00:39] <pnhChris> that seems to be a definite hurdle / extra level of complexity for templating
  179. [17:00:57] * factoryjoe (n=cmessina@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  180. [17:01:39] <tantek> speakers page
  181. [17:01:50] <tantek> here is the updated version: http://tantek.com/microformats/2006/sxsw/interactive/speakers.html
  182. [17:01:56] <tantek> with more fn/n markup etc.
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  184. [17:05:07] <pnhChris> i'd almost think it be worth spending some effort on a few constructs to examine 'name' fields .. but fear it would be wrong too often between multiple word nicknames and other hangups
  185. [17:06:35] * izo (n=izo@LNeuilly-152-23-33-39.w193-252.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit ()
  186. [17:06:47] <tantek> pnhChris, I added a suggestion for interpreting 3 word fns to the hcard-issues page
  187. [17:06:58] <tantek> on the wiki
  188. [17:07:02] <tantek> take a look and see what you think
  189. [17:07:03] * pnhChris nods
  190. [17:07:06] <pnhChris> i'll have to look yeah
  191. [17:07:53] * DanC_AUS (n=connolly@198.214.235.18) has joined #microformats
  192. [17:10:27] <pnhChris> but you have a situation like in wordpress where it stores usename, first name, last name and 'nickname" and, lets the user then set on of 6 or 7 different ways their name can be displayed in a blog post... so its not just the template that you have to get hcard info into, but much deeper into the logic (or soemplace in the middle.. i haven't looked at the code behind the display selection yet)
  193. [17:12:12] <pnhChris> or the opposite problem in textpattern where you just have a single "real name" field and a "login" field.. and peopel use the "rela name" field for anything they'd like.. their real name or some complex nickname
  194. [17:12:53] * cgriego (n=cgriego@198.214.235.18) has joined #Microformats
  195. [17:13:19] <pnhChris> (this hits the use of hcard in other formats more directly then it does standalone hcards with some explicit logic behind them for maintaining contact info)
  196. [17:18:26] <cgriego> T-12:00 to SXSWi presentation
  197. [17:18:55] * edsu (n=esummers@66.187.134.52) Quit ("leaving")
  198. [17:18:58] * edsu (n=esummers@66.187.134.52) has joined #microformats
  199. [17:19:02] * DanC_AUS wonders if he's met cgriego
  200. [17:19:36] * DanC_AUS works on an hCalendar timezone idea
  201. [17:20:02] <cgriego> I only know that we discussed a sxsw wiki, where are you at right now?
  202. [17:20:04] <pnhChris> there's the added difficulty of "bad data" in those fields such as "Smith, Jr." in the last name field
  203. [17:20:30] <pnhChris> due to only 2 fields being avaiable in the current interface
  204. [17:20:54] <DanC_AUS> I'm in the µf panel room; at the front left, by the power plugs
  205. [17:21:27] <cgriego> very corner?
  206. [17:21:38] <pnhChris> wonder how many people at sxsw chat with each other online while sitting a seat or two from each other and not know it
  207. [17:21:47] <pnhChris> silly intorweb
  208. [17:22:03] <DanC_AUS> not quite very corner. 2 rows back
  209. [17:22:24] <cgriego> I'm about 7 rows back, right against the wall
  210. [17:23:10] <pnhChris> everyone at sxsw raise your hand (or don't.. i'm not there to see anyway)
  211. [17:23:17] <cgriego> I'm sitting here because of the plug too, is there one available there? it would be a better view
  212. [17:23:25] <DanC_AUS> and where do you live in cyberspace, cgriego
  213. [17:23:27] <DanC_AUS> ?
  214. [17:23:43] <cgriego> off the cybergrid
  215. [17:24:44] <cgriego> danc_aus: is there a powerplug available over there?
  216. [17:24:52] * tantek (n=tantek@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  217. [17:24:54] * cks (n=cks@198.214.235.18) has joined #microformats
  218. [17:25:07] <DanC_AUS> yes, right in front of me
  219. [17:25:19] <cgriego> sweet
  220. [17:25:23] * cgriego (n=cgriego@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  221. [17:25:29] * rohit__ (n=rohit@64-73-232-11.cust.telepacific.net) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  222. [17:28:59] * bear_afk is now known as bear
  223. [17:29:00] * kingryan (n=kingryan@198.214.235.18) has joined #microformats
  224. [17:29:23] * ChanServ sets mode +o kingryan
  225. [17:31:05] * cgriego (n=cgriego@198.214.235.18) has joined #Microformats
  226. [17:31:15] * tantek (n=tantek@198.214.235.18) has joined #microformats
  227. [17:33:47] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  228. [17:33:55] * TantekC (n=Tantek@198.214.235.18) has joined #microformats
  229. [17:34:33] * DanC_AUS tries to think of something that'll crack tantek up ;-)
  230. [17:35:12] <DanC_AUS> hmm... BY logo got messed up
  231. [17:35:36] * hlb (i=hlb@CCCA.NCTU.edu.tw) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  232. [17:35:45] * hlb (i=hlb@CCCA.NCTU.edu.tw) has joined #microformats
  233. [17:36:17] * cgriego (n=cgriego@198.214.235.18) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  234. [17:36:19] * kingryan (n=kingryan@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  235. [17:40:48] * cgriego (n=cgriego@198.214.235.18) has joined #Microformats
  236. [17:41:01] * briansuda (n=briansud@198.214.235.18) has joined #microformats
  237. [17:42:47] * savetheclocktowr (i=adupont@cortes.dreamhost.com) has joined #microformats
  238. [17:42:49] <cks> shout-out from tantek at sxswi...
  239. [17:43:19] <DanC_AUS> what exactly does "the microformats tag" mean? does that mean "the microformats tag at technorati"?
  240. [17:43:23] <savetheclocktowr> prepare for avalanche
  241. [17:43:33] <savetheclocktowr> DanC_AUS: yes
  242. [17:43:55] <savetheclocktowr> <a rel="tag" href="whatev">microformats</a>
  243. [17:44:02] * DanC_AUS grumbles at the implication that technorati is the center of the universe
  244. [17:44:16] <DanC_AUS> really, savetheclocktowr ? href="whatev"? it doesn't matter what URI goes there?
  245. [17:44:43] <savetheclocktowr> DanC_AUS: right, because it can link to your blog category
  246. [17:44:46] * kingryan (n=kingryan@198.214.235.18) has joined #microformats
  247. [17:44:50] * ChanServ sets mode +o kingryan
  248. [17:44:58] <savetheclocktowr> technorati just indexes the link text on all <a rel="tag">s
  249. [17:45:15] <DanC_AUS> seriously? the URI is ignored?
  250. [17:45:30] <kingryan> no, we use the uri
  251. [17:45:31] <KevinMarks> false, savetheclocktowr
  252. [17:45:34] <kingryan> not the link text
  253. [17:45:39] <savetheclocktowr> i stand corrected
  254. [17:45:44] <KevinMarks> we use the last path component of the url
  255. [17:45:56] <savetheclocktowr> ah, there you go
  256. [17:46:08] <KevinMarks> we're not the centre of the universe
  257. [17:46:17] <KevinMarks> we just collect stuff from lots of the edges of it
  258. [17:46:26] <DanC_AUS> hmm... so "the microformats tag" doesn't refer to "the microformats tag at technorati" but "any .../microformats tag"
  259. [17:46:27] <savetheclocktowr> you don't have to make an explicit link to tag something... you can attach it to an existing link, like a blog category
  260. [17:46:43] <pnhChris> but i do still find the implications on rel=tag odd...
  261. [17:46:50] <KevinMarks> how so?
  262. [17:46:53] <savetheclocktowr> DanC_AUS: it means "use the tag microformat to tag your blog post 'microformat'"
  263. [17:46:57] <savetheclocktowr> meta enough for you?
  264. [17:47:13] <pnhChris> given that its stuppsoed to point to a specific tag 'cloud' but that information is almost universally ignored
  265. [17:47:19] <DanC_AUS> well, using a delicious tag would work too, yes?
  266. [17:47:25] <pnhChris> wow.. i can't type
  267. [17:47:30] <KevinMarks> yes
  268. [17:47:39] <KevinMarks> or a flickr one or a Wikiepdia one
  269. [17:47:53] <pnhChris> or magnolia, or an internal reference
  270. [17:48:18] <pnhChris> but but how often is that interpreted as "a wikipedia tag"
  271. [17:48:20] <savetheclocktowr> and as long as technorati crawls that page, or its corresponding feed, it'll pick up that tag
  272. [17:48:54] <KevinMarks> well, we store the link url, but we don't distinguish in indexing or display at the moment
  273. [17:49:22] <KevinMarks> the point is the link should help express the meaning fo the tag
  274. [17:49:25] <DanC_AUS> "last path segment of the URI" is an interesting thing to index. hmm. hmm.
  275. [17:49:37] <pnhChris> does anyone? what are the implications given most of the time people pick an arbitrary (or favorite) destination anyways?
  276. [17:49:55] <KevinMarks> if you use a generic tagspace like tehcnorati, it means you are open to consensus definition
  277. [17:50:21] <KevinMarks> if you pick your own category archive, you indicate you have a more personal view
  278. [17:50:39] <DanC_AUS> consensus... quite. you're delegating to "the wisdom of crowds"
  279. [17:50:41] <pnhChris> that's a helluva implication
  280. [17:51:19] <pnhChris> ... which begs my other question.. why isn't there a way to explicitly state its a consensus or genericly defined tag
  281. [17:51:22] <pnhChris> ;)
  282. [17:51:37] <KevinMarks> because one way is sufficient
  283. [17:51:41] * DanC_AUS can't imagine how to me more explicit
  284. [17:51:52] <savetheclocktowr> pnhChris: because those aren't mutually exclusive categories
  285. [17:51:58] <savetheclocktowr> nor are they objective
  286. [17:51:58] <pnhChris> is there a list somewhere that differentiates the "consensus" based clouds with specific clouds?
  287. [17:52:12] <kingryan> someone have the URL of the review page norm used?
  288. [17:52:26] <DanC_AUS> the other parts of the URI tell you whose defintion of the tag you're buying into
  289. [17:52:55] * DanC_AUS has been noodling on filling in lat/long from other hCard fields
  290. [17:53:11] * DanC_AUS is bummed that he missed the mapping panel
  291. [17:53:19] <pnhChris> anyway.. this goes back to my hatom questions on feed categories and there not being a good way to map keywords/tags that might not be represented as links to generic namespaces... which there doesn't seem to be a good resolution to
  292. [17:53:37] <qid> DanC_AUS: that would be called "geocoding" I belive
  293. [17:54:38] * Kura (n=Kura@198.214.235.18) has joined #microformats
  294. [17:55:00] <savetheclocktowr> DanC_AUS: and the Y! geocoding API is freaking awesome
  295. [17:57:02] * DanC_AUS wishes for a 4 hour time stoppage in which to hack with the Y! geocoding API
  296. [17:57:14] <savetheclocktowr> DanC_AUS: srsly
  297. [17:57:30] * kingryan (n=kingryan@198.214.235.18) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  298. [17:57:33] <savetheclocktowr> you can pass it a string with as much or as little location info as you please
  299. [17:57:37] <savetheclocktowr> and it'll return a lat and lon
  300. [17:59:08] <DanC_AUS> er... yeah, what's the benefit of adding class="xoxo"?
  301. [17:59:24] <KevinMarks> a hint to parsers
  302. [17:59:30] <DanC_AUS> to which parsers?
  303. [17:59:51] <KevinMarks> pareses looking for lists of things
  304. [17:59:55] <DanC_AUS> I use xoxo for my gtd-style projects list; combined with some .css and .js to animate it, it's kinda cool.
  305. [18:00:09] <KevinMarks> cool
  306. [18:00:17] <DanC_AUS> like what parsers looking for lists of strings? especially which ones that don't find <ul> by itself sufficient
  307. [18:00:30] <KevinMarks> add it to the implementations section if it's public
  308. [18:00:52] <KevinMarks> well, it makes thta kind of CSS-fu easier if you have other kinds of lists around too
  309. [18:01:45] * izo (n=izo@boi59-1-82-66-128-84.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #microformats
  310. [18:01:59] <DanC_AUS> I mostly adapted existing stuff from the implementations section
  311. [18:02:31] <savetheclocktowr> right, not all lists are outlines
  312. [18:02:44] <DanC_AUS> the "url" field in vCalendar and hCalendar is such a tease; you want to add not just the person's homepage, but *also* a link to the sxsw panel info page
  313. [18:04:15] <TantekC> http://tantek.com/presentations/2006/03/microformats-sxsw/
  314. [18:07:16] <DanC_AUS> where does the "tails" name come from, I wonder
  315. [18:08:11] <cgriego> I was just wondering that
  316. [18:08:18] * sketchyd (i=sketchyd@pool-71-250-176-38.nwrknj.east.verizon.net) has joined #microformats
  317. [18:09:06] <briansuda> http://blog.codeeg.com/tails-firefox-extension
  318. [18:10:53] <mfbot> [[events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5385 * ChristopherStJohn * (+42) Attending -
  319. [18:12:07] * valmont (n=chrishol@germany.pspdev.pas.earthlink.net) has joined #microformats
  320. [18:18:44] * izo (n=izo@boi59-1-82-66-128-84.fbx.proxad.net) Quit ()
  321. [18:20:20] * KevinMarks (n=Snak@pdpc/supporter/active/kevinmarks) Quit ("The computer fell asleep")
  322. [18:22:42] * kingryan (n=kingryan@198.214.235.18) has joined #microformats
  323. [18:22:47] * ChanServ sets mode +o kingryan
  324. [18:23:20] * hollym (n=holly@adsl-69-212-1-147.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) has joined #microformats
  325. [18:26:09] * DanC_AUS wonders when the big push for hAtom should start
  326. [18:27:35] <mfbot> [[events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5386 * Lucian * (+35) Attending -
  327. [18:28:00] * briansuda (n=briansud@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  328. [18:28:42] <pnhChris> what are there in terms of consumers out there now.. anything new?
  329. [18:29:01] * pnhChris checks the wiki again
  330. [18:29:22] * savetheclocktowr (i=adupont@cortes.dreamhost.com) Quit ()
  331. [18:29:24] * cks (n=cks@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  332. [18:30:18] <pnhChris> nope.. nothing since i've last been
  333. [18:30:37] * tantek (n=tantek@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  334. [18:31:28] * Kura (n=Kura@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  335. [18:33:40] * cgriego (n=cgriego@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  336. [18:34:58] * TantekC (n=Tantek@198.214.235.18) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  337. [18:35:29] * kingryan (n=kingryan@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
  338. [18:38:31] <mfbot> [[hcard]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5387 * EdwardOConnor * (-13) Examples - s/evdb/eventful/
  339. [18:38:59] * cgriego (n=cgriego@198.214.235.18) has joined #Microformats
  340. [18:42:17] * rohit__ (n=rohit@64-73-232-11.cust.telepacific.net) has joined #microformats
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  343. [18:51:33] * schepers (n=schepers@66-194-222-226.gen.twtelecom.net) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  344. [18:51:35] * DanC_AUS (n=connolly@198.214.235.18) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  345. [18:53:53] <mfbot> [[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5388 * DanielMorrison * (+131) Examples in the wild -
  346. [18:55:44] <mfbot> [[events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-03-13-sxsw-microformats&diff=0&oldid=5389 * Schaapy * (+40) Attending -
  347. [18:59:07] * rohit__ (n=rohit@64-73-232-11.cust.telepacific.net) has joined #microformats
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  350. [19:04:33] * cgriego (n=cgriego@198.214.235.18) Quit ()
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  354. [19:24:17] * rohit__ (n=rohit@64-73-232-11.cust.telepacific.net) Quit ()
  355. [19:25:01] <mfbot> [[hcard]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=5390 * GatorDavid * (+72) New Examples -
  356. [19:57:46] * sketchyd (i=sketchyd@pool-71-250-176-38.nwrknj.east.verizon.net) Quit ()
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  371. [20:54:30] <amanuel> so who is going to sxsw
  372. [20:58:22] <amanuel> link to tails extension is broken on http://microformats.org/blog/2006/03/13/microformats-at-sxsw/
  373. [20:58:30] <amanuel> http:// is missing
  374. [21:07:57] * briansuda (n=briansud@63.97.158.3) has joined #microformats
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