IRC Log for #microformats on 2006-08-20

Timestamps are in UTC.

  1. [00:00:04] * Mr_Elusive (n=Mr_Elusi@S0106000f66365909.wp.shawcable.net) Quit ("www.ie7.com It's Unreal TOURNAMENT 2007, learn 2 type ten more letters ffs!")
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  11. [04:33:45] <DanC> hmm... drupal and microformats at a drupal conference in Sept. http://drupalcon.org/node/36
  12. [04:36:59] <mfbot> [[events]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events&diff=0&oldid=8201 * DanC * (+99) drupalcon in Brussels
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  16. [04:55:40] <mfbot> [[events]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events&diff=0&oldid=8202 * Tantek * (+0) sorted
  17. [04:57:38] * vmarks (n=vmarks@cpe-065-190-165-181.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  18. [04:59:17] <briansuda> DanC, i just found out about that too! I'm there the week before for EuroOSCON speaking about Microformats - no one told/asked me about the Drupal event
  19. [04:59:46] <DanC> the week before? isn't it just a day before?
  20. [05:00:19] <briansuda> 18-21st is EuroOSCON
  21. [05:00:23] <briansuda> this is the 23rd
  22. [05:00:28] <briansuda> so a few days before
  23. [05:01:07] <briansuda> there is about 3-4 events happening that week in Brussels
  24. [05:01:27] <briansuda> BarCamp, EuroOSCON, Drupal, and something else.
  25. [05:01:36] <tantek> greetings
  26. [05:01:45] <briansuda> evening
  27. [05:01:57] <briansuda> GovCamp, DrupalCon, and BarCamp
  28. [05:02:22] <qid> ok, whoever thought up the system for signing and encrypting e-mail is clearly a sociopath
  29. [05:03:58] <qid> keys, certificates, certificate revocation lists, certificate authorities, signing keys, signatures, keyservers, revocation certificates, key trust... this is getting ridiculous
  30. [05:04:43] * imajes (n=imajes@growl/imajes) Quit ()
  31. [05:05:10] <tantek> qid, indeed. the epitome of user-friendliness. not.
  32. [05:05:44] * imajes (n=imajes@cpc2-ware3-0-0-cust617.lutn.cable.ntl.com) has joined #microformats
  33. [05:06:25] <qid> and heaven forbid I try to set up SSL on my web server
  34. [05:07:36] * imajes (n=imajes@growl/imajes) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  35. [05:13:40] * briansuda can't seem to pull up http://gmpg.org/
  36. [05:24:33] * briansuda (n=briansud@AC91AFCF.ipt.aol.com) Quit ("need some sleep")
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  46. [07:24:40] <tantek> greetings
  47. [07:25:13] <tantek> did folks see Les Orchard's recent post "Don't ask me who I am": http://decafbad.com/blog/2006/08/17/dont-ask-me-who-i-am
  48. [07:26:19] <tantek> I've left a comment but it is awaiting moderation.
  49. [07:26:36] * Phae (n=phae@bb-87-80-218-92.ukonline.co.uk) has joined #microformats
  50. [07:26:43] <tantek> hello Phae
  51. [07:26:52] <Phae> moring
  52. [07:26:54] <Phae> oops. morning*
  53. [07:27:06] <tantek> evening ;)
  54. [07:27:13] <Phae> :)
  55. [07:27:21] * Phae hasn't put on her glasses yet.
  56. [07:27:28] <tantek> I just mentioned Les Orchard's post recent post "Don't ask me who I am": http://decafbad.com/blog/2006/08/17/dont-ask-me-who-i-am
  57. [07:27:35] <Phae> oh
  58. [07:27:46] * Phae looks.
  59. [07:28:15] <tantek> I've left a comment which is awaiting moderation but I think I will copy it here for our archives as well.
  60. [07:28:22] <tantek> Indeed Les, this is exactly what <a href="http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard">hCard</a> solves on the Web with the minimum of duplication of data into hidden places and mimetype hackery/configuration (problems of the other approaches mentioned).
  61. [07:28:27] <tantek> You can either use a 3rd party service like claimID as mentioned to claim your various profiles on the Web, or you can simply continue to publish your profile information on your about or author page, simply add just a bit of hCard markup, and use <a href="http://www.gmpg.org/xfn/and/#idconsolidation">XFN Identity Consolidation</a> (rel="me") to turn your about page into your consolidated identity hub.
  62. [07:28:33] <tantek> While services will undoubtedly continue to ask you a hundred profile questions, the better ones will do something as simple as use the simple open source <a href="http://www.allinthehead.com/hkit">hKit Microformats Toolkit</a> by <a href="http://www.allinthehead.com/">Drew McLellan</a> to let you simply enter your hCard URL and fill out all the questions automatically from that.
  63. [07:28:39] <tantek> And the best services will help you, the user, keep your profile as portable as you would like it, by marking it up with hCard as well. Already, profiles on numerous services, in addition to the abovementioned claimID, like <a href="http://flickr.com/">Flickr</a> and <a href="http://technorati.com/">Technorati</a> are marked up with hCard and thus ready for reuse with services that use hKit.
  64. [07:28:45] <tantek> Finally, some have brought up "extensibility" as something that is desirable yet recent lessons have taught us that in terms of standards and interoperability, the opposite is true. The more well-defined not-infinitely-extensible a standard is, the sooner implementers know they are "done" implementing it (interoperably even!), and the less chance there is of a zillion non-interoperable extensions randomly emerging (i.e.
  65. [07:28:53] <Phae> He makes a good point
  66. [07:28:58] <Phae> I'd like to be able to do that too.
  67. [07:29:54] <tantek> Whoa, here is another cool tool: XFN Graph: http://blogs.lovelysystems.com/reutz/archives/16
  68. [07:30:24] <Phae> oh pretty. I've seen link diagrams like that before.
  69. [07:30:25] <tantek> Phae, now that Drew has written hKit, I think all the pieces have been built in a reusable format to solve the problem that Les mentions.
  70. [07:30:36] <Phae> I'm surprised we've not seen another for xfn sooner
  71. [07:30:41] <Phae> that's cool.
  72. [07:30:46] <Phae> hKit is a nice tool.
  73. [07:31:01] <tantek> yes, and deserves much more coverage
  74. [07:31:16] <Phae> plug plug
  75. [07:31:22] <Phae> I'm sure it'll get plugged at barcamp
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  80. [07:58:27] <tantek> here is another interesting recent post: "Microformatting my Addressbook" by Stan Jones: http://www.sunshocked.com/stanifesto/archives/microformatting-my-addressbook/
  81. [08:03:05] <tantek> this is an interesting critical read, and yet another use/definition of "picoformats": http://rlucas.net/blog/tech/picoformats.html
  82. [08:04:11] * vant (n=vant@FLH1Abe103.isk.mesh.ad.jp) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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  84. [08:13:16] <mfbot> [[events/2006-08-17-refresh-dc-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-08-17-refresh-dc-microformats&diff=0&oldid=8203 * Tantek * (+157) added blog posts section with mjb blog post
  85. [08:21:32] <mfbot> [[events]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events&diff=0&oldid=8204 * Tantek * (+126) added Microformats Bay Area Caltech mtg and move past events to Recent section
  86. [08:26:13] * valmont (n=chrishol@pdpc/supporter/silver/valmont) Quit ()
  87. [08:27:47] <tantek> I wonder if there is any intersection between hResume and http://thingsicando.com/
  88. [08:27:55] <tantek> 43skills?
  89. [08:28:03] <tantek> or even 43skillz
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  93. [09:24:45] <mfbot> [[events]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events&diff=0&oldid=8205 * Tantek * (+174) added BarCampEarth and BarCampTexas
  94. [10:20:03] <mfbot> [[xfolk]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=xfolk&diff=0&oldid=8206 * Tantek * (+129) added blip.tv implementation announcement
  95. [10:59:00] <_fil_> http://www.jquery.info/IMG/html/5_geo.html
  96. [10:59:30] <_fil_> shows how jQuery and microformats can interact
  97. [11:00:24] <_fil_> the article is at http://www.jquery.info/spip.php?article7
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  100. [11:21:35] <mfbot> [[geo-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=geo-fr&diff=0&oldid=8207 * Fil * (+166) Implémentations - jQuery et geo
  101. [11:22:41] <mfbot> [[geo]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=geo&diff=0&oldid=8208 * Fil * (+145) Implementations - jQuery and geo
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  108. [13:04:51] <davecardwell> _fil_: just spotted it from the jquery mailing list
  109. [13:04:53] <davecardwell> nice work
  110. [13:05:58] <_fil_> I think we should make more
  111. [13:06:06] <_fil_> there's an obvious convergence
  112. [13:06:18] <_fil_> that will boost both communities
  113. [13:07:01] <_fil_> because one difficulty with mf is that there are no easy tools to manipulate them
  114. [13:07:06] <_fil_> s/is/was/ :)
  115. [13:07:51] <davecardwell> xpath support in jquery's $() should come in handy
  116. [13:07:58] <davecardwell> never considered using it for uF stuff
  117. [13:12:32] <_fil_> yes, I need to work on this
  118. [13:13:13] <_fil_> I don't quite understand how you ask, for example, for "all the <dd> that follow a <dt> in the same <dl>"
  119. [13:13:34] <_fil_> I tried many things within jquery and never got it right
  120. [13:29:40] * Whiskey_M (n=Richard@host-84-9-127-20.bulldogdsl.com) has joined #microformats
  121. [13:29:42] <Whiskey_M> 'lo
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  123. [13:50:51] <mfbot> [[rel-license-ja]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-license-ja * JinichiHiguchi * (+3845)
  124. [13:54:07] <mfbot> [[Main Page-ja]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Main_Page-ja&diff=0&oldid=8209 * JinichiHiguchi * (+17) 仕様 -
  125. [14:00:03] <mfbot> [[rel-license-ja]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-license-ja&diff=0&oldid=8210 * JinichiHiguchi * (+86) Informative References -
  126. [14:05:24] <mfbot> [[rel-license-ja]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-license-ja&diff=0&oldid=8211 * JinichiHiguchi * (+0) 要約 -
  127. [14:05:45] <mfbot> [[rel-license-ja]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-license-ja&diff=0&oldid=8212 * JinichiHiguchi * (+0) rel="license" -
  128. [14:06:51] <mfbot> [[rel-license-ja]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-license-ja&diff=0&oldid=8213 * JinichiHiguchi * (+3) 特許 -
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  130. [14:24:03] <mfbot> [[rel-license-ja]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-license-ja&diff=0&oldid=8214 * JinichiHiguchi * (+37)
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  134. [15:08:00] <mfbot> [[rel-license-ja]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-license-ja&diff=0&oldid=8215 * JinichiHiguchi * (+0)
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  142. [15:27:20] <whafro> If I'm going to mark up a single person's blog with hCard, would I do it both on the front page in the little "about" box and on the extended "about" page, or just on the page, which has more information to be included in the hCard?
  143. [15:28:46] <drewinthehead> whafro: i tend to do all instances - if it's contact information, make it an hCard
  144. [15:30:27] <whafro> yeah, I'm sorta conflicted about it... would microformat-aware searches (like technorati's) be aware of the more fully-populated card and give that priority?
  145. [15:32:08] <whafro> (should have waited another few hours until Tantek is up and about for that half of the question ;-))
  146. [15:50:26] <drewinthehead> yeah, that depends entirely on the implementation
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  152. [16:26:24] * cori[s] is now known as coris
  153. [16:28:49] * coris is now known as cori[s]
  154. [16:46:26] <tantek> whafro, you can use xfn identity consolidation (i.e. rel="me") to connect a home page and a person's about page with the extended information. then microformat-aware searches can conclude that they are the same person and thus merge the information or at least prefer the one with more information.
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  159. [17:33:51] * ChanServ sets mode +o briansuda
  160. [17:34:02] <drewinthehead> greetings all
  161. [17:36:23] <Phae> hey drew
  162. [17:36:31] <drewinthehead> hey Phae :)
  163. [17:36:46] <briansuda> evening
  164. [17:36:50] <drewinthehead> hi briansuda
  165. [17:37:44] <briansuda> anything new and exciting developments?
  166. [17:37:45] <drewinthehead> just when i thought i'd have an evening to hack on some mF stuff, we've had a server fail :(
  167. [17:38:01] <briansuda> keep an eye on this one http://microformatique.com/
  168. [17:38:10] <Phae> oi. drew. we need to do a microbrewery thing.
  169. [17:38:27] <drewinthehead> yes, we do
  170. [17:38:40] <drewinthehead> pick a month
  171. [17:39:03] <Phae> well, post d.construct
  172. [17:39:10] <Phae> maybe pre-WSG?
  173. [17:39:14] <Phae> end of sept?
  174. [17:39:24] <drewinthehead> who's is that, briansuda?
  175. [17:39:38] <drewinthehead> pre as in sometime before or right before, Phae?
  176. [17:40:05] <Phae> i'm not fussed. the date isn't confirmed for which thursday in october though.
  177. [17:40:23] <drewinthehead> i'm pretty sure it's going to be the 19th (shhh!)
  178. [17:40:30] <Phae> heh
  179. [17:40:31] <Phae> ok
  180. [17:41:38] <drewinthehead> briansuda: duh, i see it's johnallsopp
  181. [17:41:40] <Phae> ok. diary time.
  182. [17:41:55] <drewinthehead> ical at the ready ...
  183. [17:42:32] <Phae> argh. load faster
  184. [17:44:25] <drewinthehead> it depends what sort of thing we want to do, i suppose
  185. [17:44:25] * Phae (n=phae@bb-87-80-218-92.ukonline.co.uk) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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  187. [17:44:47] * Faye is now known as Phae
  188. [17:44:54] <Phae> grr
  189. [17:45:05] <Phae> weekend slot, drew?
  190. [17:47:01] <drewinthehead> i think a weekend would be good
  191. [17:47:23] <Phae> okay. 16th, 23rd, 30th?
  192. [17:47:33] <Phae> those are the september weekends
  193. [17:47:44] * briansuda is waiting to see if he can attend
  194. [17:47:58] <drewinthehead> what are your dates, briansuda?
  195. [17:48:32] <briansuda> not sure yet... i have a small passport problem, so i will see if it is resolved by then
  196. [17:48:38] <Phae> :(
  197. [17:48:59] <drewinthehead> i get spam about small passport problems all the time
  198. [17:49:37] <drewinthehead> so, beginning of sept is barcamp
  199. [17:49:57] <briansuda> no big deal, after arrival i have to send it off to get stamped for additional permits, so i will be without it for a time... depend on how fast they return it
  200. [17:49:57] <Phae> yep, that's really soon
  201. [17:50:19] <Phae> then the weekend after is d.construct and geek in the park on saturday
  202. [17:50:51] <drewinthehead> week after that i'm not available, and we could probably all do with a weekend off anyway ;)
  203. [17:51:01] <Phae> I agree.
  204. [17:51:07] <Phae> I was hoping for a weekend to sleep for a change.
  205. [17:51:27] <drewinthehead> 30th?
  206. [17:51:36] <Phae> No issues with that here.
  207. [17:51:44] <drewinthehead> i'll check upcoming.org
  208. [17:51:49] <Phae> ok
  209. [17:52:15] <drewinthehead> looks clear
  210. [17:52:27] <Phae> swish.
  211. [17:52:37] <drewinthehead> Download festival in SF .. but i don't think we need worry about that ;)
  212. [17:52:42] <Phae> nah
  213. [17:52:51] <Phae> Okay. Lets go with the 30th.
  214. [17:52:55] <Phae> this planning malarky is easy.
  215. [17:53:09] <drewinthehead> :)
  216. [17:53:24] <Phae> microbrewery? I only know of the one down in blackheath
  217. [17:54:22] <drewinthehead> blackheath may be a bit off the beaten track - what do you think?
  218. [17:54:38] <Phae> I agree. It's not close enough to a tube.
  219. [17:56:31] <drewinthehead> what sort of thing are we going for? just a meet, or a dinner, or..?
  220. [17:56:57] <Phae> hmmm...
  221. [17:57:18] <drewinthehead> something with bagels?
  222. [17:57:20] <Phae> being a saturday means we can do any of those things.
  223. [17:57:28] <Phae> late lunch/dinner type food
  224. [17:57:31] * csarven (i=nevrasc@modemcable163.203-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #microformats
  225. [17:57:42] <Phae> mm.. bagels
  226. [17:58:49] <drewinthehead> perhaps we could put the word out, see who's around and interested, and get some feel for what ppl would like to do
  227. [17:59:06] <Phae> okay.
  228. [18:00:43] <drewinthehead> if it turns out there's only going to be half a dozen people, that makes it a different sort of event
  229. [18:00:54] <Phae> sure
  230. [18:01:06] <drewinthehead> i've no idea what the take-up might be like
  231. [18:02:04] <Phae> well, lets put the word out to do something for the 30th. we can always make people go during the next couple of events
  232. [18:02:08] <Phae> contract them
  233. [18:02:30] <drewinthehead> promise bagels
  234. [18:02:36] * Phae nods.
  235. [18:02:54] * Phae puts it in her calender.
  236. [18:03:06] <drewinthehead> should we call it a vevent?
  237. [18:03:31] <Phae> ooo. yes.
  238. [18:03:41] <drewinthehead> London Microformats vEvent
  239. [18:03:48] <Phae> :D
  240. [18:09:11] <mfbot> [[events]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events&diff=0&oldid=8216 * DrewMcLellan * (+110) Upcoming -
  241. [18:10:17] <mfbot> [[events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent * DrewMcLellan * (+115)
  242. [18:13:07] <drewinthehead> grr .. upcoming.org needs a venue :/
  243. [18:13:31] <Phae> how restrictive
  244. [18:15:41] <briansuda> i think you can just put "london" as the venue and then update it later
  245. [18:17:34] <drewinthehead> i tried that, no joy
  246. [18:17:57] <drewinthehead> i think they're trying to tie down on some of the sketchy data that people input, which is fair enough ;)
  247. [18:18:39] <briansuda> maybe you should make a "fake" venue
  248. [18:18:51] <briansuda> something that is obvious to UK culture that it doesn't exist
  249. [18:19:01] <briansuda> 21 Baker street or something
  250. [18:19:26] <briansuda> then all unknowns go into that - those USA Yahooligans will just assume it is a real place
  251. [18:19:33] <mfbot> [[events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent&diff=0&oldid=8217 * Phae * (+158) setup structure
  252. [18:24:29] <drewinthehead> http://upcoming.org/event/100107/
  253. [18:24:44] <drewinthehead> i just missed out on a cool event ID!
  254. [18:24:57] <Phae> cool
  255. [18:25:15] <briansuda> nearly geeky binary
  256. [18:25:24] <Phae> heh
  257. [18:25:32] <drewinthehead> quite
  258. [18:25:42] <briansuda> it would have been better if it was a palindrome as well 1001001
  259. [18:30:29] <mfbot> [[events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent&diff=0&oldid=8218 * DrewMcLellan * (+56) Details - added link to upcoming.org
  260. [18:30:54] <Phae> oh. I was doing that, but my internet is sucking.
  261. [18:31:04] <drewinthehead> sorry
  262. [18:31:08] <Phae> it's cool :)
  263. [18:35:52] <drewinthehead> back in 20mins .. need to put the bins out :)
  264. [18:36:06] <mfbot> [[events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent&diff=0&oldid=8219 * Phae * (+58) added myself
  265. [18:36:09] <Phae> domesticated
  266. [18:36:29] * briansuda wonders why it takes 20 minutes to do that?
  267. [18:36:41] <Phae> He has a very long driveway
  268. [18:36:51] <briansuda> he'd better live 10 stories up
  269. [18:47:10] * Phae (n=phae@bb-87-80-218-92.ukonline.co.uk) Quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
  270. [18:47:40] * Phae (n=phae@bb-87-80-218-92.ukonline.co.uk) has joined #microformats
  271. [18:50:52] <mfbot> [[events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent&diff=0&oldid=8220 * Tantek * (+11) inline link to events home page
  272. [18:52:03] <mfbot> [[events]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events&diff=0&oldid=8221 * Tantek * (+0) fixed month on EuroOSCon event entry and moved it back to the future
  273. [18:55:25] <drewinthehead> back ...
  274. [18:56:59] <mfbot> [[events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-09-30-london-microformats-vevent&diff=0&oldid=8222 * DrewMcLellan * (+63) Attending -
  275. [18:57:13] <drewinthehead> just 2 floors up, briansuda :)
  276. [18:59:54] <drewinthehead> so, we should publicise this, Phae
  277. [19:00:28] <drewinthehead> else it'll just be you, me, a passportless briansuda and some bagels
  278. [19:00:41] <drewinthehead> (although that sounds like a good evening in itself)
  279. [19:03:35] <briansuda> more bagels for me
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