IRC Log for #microformats on 2007-06-21
Timestamps are in UTC.
- [00:00:27] <tantek>
your home page is a directory index is that correct?
- [00:00:32] <tantek>
(just making sure)
- [00:00:35] <unfo>
tantek, yes.
- [00:01:02] <unfo>
tantek, i guess the closest thing I have to an appropriate webpage is http://wikipedia.org/wiki/user:unforgettableid
- [00:01:04] <tantek>
have you considered adding a README.txt ?
- [00:01:15] <tantek>
or is tips.txt your version of README?
- [00:01:21] <unfo>
tantek, i have an old webpage. http://jspiro.tripod.com. I'll eventually move it.
- [00:01:40] <unfo>
i should get an 00README.txt or whatever apache will display at the top of the index
- [00:01:46] <unfo>
i really have no current website.
- [00:02:16] <tantek>
unfo, I like your multilicense statement on your wikipedia user page
- [00:02:22] <unfo>
tantek, thank you.
- [00:02:39] <unfo>
what do you think about those webpages I mentioned in general?
- [00:02:41] <tantek>
I may borrow from it (presumably with your permission per the license ;) ) to write my own.
- [00:02:47] <unfo>
tantek, it's a template
- [00:03:00] <unfo>
tantek, edit this page, then scroll down to Templates Used on This Page
- [00:03:00] <tantek>
do a lot of people use it?
- [00:03:10] <unfo>
tantek, dunno. What Links Here can tell you.
- [00:03:22] <tantek>
does What Links Here count template uses?
- [00:03:31] <unfo>
yes, if you visit the template page first
- [00:03:44] <unfo>
wikipedia has loads of data.
- [00:03:55] <unfo>
anyone know about the German "Personendaten" thing?
- [00:04:20] <unfo>
it means "Living Person Data". it's css display:none so it shows up in Lynx.
- [00:04:31] <unfo>
it has IIRC first name, last name, and date of birth.
- [00:04:43] <unfo>
they use it sometimes on English Wikipedia too.
- [00:04:56] <unfo>
infoboxes could be excellent candidates for microformats.
- [00:05:10] <unfo>
but then what? I am reminded of MS Office Smart Tags. Ugh.
- [00:05:16] <tantek>
unfo, yes, i believe at least one of the infobox templates already has hCard in it!
- [00:05:30] <unfo>
the wikipedia backend is GPLed.
- [00:05:43] <tantek>
looks like quite a few people use the Template:Public domain release that you do: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Whatlinkshere/Template:Public_domain_release
- [00:05:48] <unfo>
what firefox extensions can i get that will alert me to the presence of microformats whenever I see them?
- [00:06:05] <tantek>
Operator
- [00:06:06] <bewest>
operator
- [00:06:06] <unfo>
tantek, a famous wikipedian, User:Ram-Man, advocated the use of multilicensing.
- [00:06:32] <unfo>
tantek, Ram-Man wrote the first wikipedia bot. It turned CVS census data into textual articles.
- [00:06:33] <tantek>
unfo, here is an example of a Wikipedia page that uses an infobox template that supports hCard: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neal_Stephenson
- [00:07:05] <unfo>
how can i tell there's a microformat there?
- [00:07:50] <tantek>
from the web page, you can't, because it is not required, and Wikipedia has not yet chosen to make it a part of the user interface (which is perfectly fine). however, install Operator and Firefox and visit the page
- [00:07:59] <tantek>
Operator *in* Firefox that is
- [00:08:13] <unfo>
<robot>Please wait while I try that extension</robot>
- [00:08:17] <tantek>
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/4106
- [00:08:19] <unfo>
*click*
- [00:08:32] <tantek>
first Google result for the word "Operator" - amazing
- [00:09:41] <tantek>
unfo, /wiki/irc-people is helpful for folks communicating in this channel, feel free to just link it to your user page
- [00:25:24] <mfbot>
[[xfolk-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=xfolk-fr&diff=0&oldid=17692 * DnpM5r * (-13990)
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- [01:30:03] <unfo>
i tried operator for 30 seconds and i'm not impressed yet. What websites should I try visiting?
- [01:48:39] <unfo>
i tried operator for 30 seconds and i'm not impressed yet. What websites should I try visiting?
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- [02:35:45] <mfbot>
[[uid-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=uid-examples&diff=0&oldid=17693 * Ku9Ac6 * (-2327)
- [02:36:01] * DanC (n=connolly@pdpc/supporter/active/DanC) has joined #microformats
- [02:36:27] <DanC>
any thoughts on representing flights using microformats? a flight is one event with two locations
- [02:36:35] <DanC>
or... one long, skinny location
- [02:37:24] <unfo>
DanC, how do the XML people represent flights?
- [02:37:29] <unfo>
e.g. for EDI
- [02:38:30] <DanC>
dunno
- [02:39:36] <DanC>
there's a plain text format that seems to be used by SABRE. see TestData=... in http://dig.csail.mit.edu/2006/data4/flightCal.py
- [02:40:44] <DanC>
and there are any number of general purpose ontologies for describing "starting point" and "ending point" and such
- [02:41:22] <DanC>
hmm... I suppose a flight could be 2 events, each with a location
- [02:41:53] <DanC>
that's not how I want it to show up in my calendar, usually, though
- [02:54:29] <mfbot>
[[licensing-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=licensing-examples&diff=0&oldid=17694 * GuzHgl * (-3699)
- [02:57:55] <mfbot>
[[hatom-hints]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-hints&diff=0&oldid=17695 * LrkYuo * (-4162)
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- [03:17:40] <DanC>
hmm... googling around brings me back to http://microformats.org/wiki/directions-examples
- [03:19:02] <DanC>
not much meat on the bones there
- [03:24:33] <tantek>
DanC, your point about "how I want it to show up in my calendar" is I think a clue about the right methodology
- [03:24:45] <tantek>
as in, defining the user scenario you are looking to solve
- [03:24:53] <tantek>
scenarios plural even
- [03:25:16] <tantek>
a flight does feel like a travel segment
- [03:25:18] <tantek>
which might be an item in a directions format
- [03:25:30] <tantek>
which could represent a series of flights as well
- [03:25:40] <tantek>
or
- [03:25:45] <tantek>
a series of flight + train etc.
- [03:25:50] <tantek>
or even
- [03:25:57] <tantek>
flight + train + walking
- [03:25:59] <DanC>
the main user scenario I'm actually persuing (sp?) tonight is one of those "this year in flights" diagrams.
- [03:26:01] <tantek>
say to a W3C meeting
- [03:26:21] <tantek>
ah, infoporn, got it
- [03:26:26] <mfbot>
[[hatom-hints]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-hints&diff=0&oldid=17696 * Tantek * (+4162) Reverted edit of LrkYuo, changed back to last version by ScottReynen
- [03:26:36] <DanC>
I actually have pretty good hCalendar versions of my itiernaries; they don't have good geo info in them, though
- [03:26:37] <mfbot>
[[licensing-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=licensing-examples&diff=0&oldid=17697 * Tantek * (+3699) Reverted edit of GuzHgl, changed back to last version by Tantek
- [03:26:43] <mfbot>
[[uid-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=uid-examples&diff=0&oldid=17698 * Tantek * (+2327) Reverted edit of Ku9Ac6, changed back to last version by Tantek
- [03:26:49] <mfbot>
[[xfolk-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=xfolk-fr&diff=0&oldid=17699 * Tantek * (+13990) Reverted edit of DnpM5r, changed back to last version by Tantek
- [03:27:45] <mfbot>
[[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) blocked "User:LrkYuo" with an expiry time of infinite: damage/spam
- [03:27:51] <mfbot>
[[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) blocked "User:GuzHgl" with an expiry time of infinite: damage/spam
- [03:27:57] <mfbot>
[[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) blocked "User:Ku9Ac6" with an expiry time of infinite: damage/spam
- [03:27:58] <mfbot>
[[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) blocked "User:DnpM5r" with an expiry time of infinite: damage/spam
- [03:28:36] <DanC>
the directions microformat does seem like a good idea... though it's not clear that the effort doesn't all go into proprietary approaches due to market deman
- [03:28:58] <DanC>
(is that enough negatives in one sentence?)
- [03:29:19] <tantek>
that's the problem with excess negatives in a sentence, it sets the framing all wrong
- [03:29:36] <tantek>
whereas if we word things positively, even if we only solve a small problem, we at least solve a problem
- [03:29:44] <tantek>
which is a point to build from
- [03:29:57] <DanC>
I was boggled the 1st time I printed some yahoo maps directions and there was no advertisement on the hardcopy.
- [03:30:07] <DanC>
though I guess you can't click thru on a hardcopy
- [03:30:34] <DanC>
ok, back to solving a problem...
- [03:30:40] <tantek>
DanC, perhaps add a few of the scenarios you mentioned (e.g. year in flights), especially if you have current examples for them, to http://microformats.org/wiki/directions-examples
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- [03:30:47] <DanC>
two locations on one hCard event is a no-no, yes?
- [03:30:54] <tantek>
let's at least collect your ideas/behavior
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- [03:31:06] <tantek>
so that we can encourage directions work to take it into account
- [03:31:23] <tantek>
hCalendar only has one location property
- [03:31:31] <tantek>
hmm... are you asking about singularity?
- [03:31:32] <DanC>
and it only takes one valie?
- [03:31:43] <tantek>
i'd have to check 2445
- [03:31:52] <tantek>
i don't have that level of detail memorized
- [03:32:08] <tantek>
though we should document that, just as Ryan and I did for hcard-singular-properties
- [03:32:11] * DanC is fairly sure it only takes one
- [03:32:32] * DanC looks for his year-in-flights bookmarks...
- [03:32:40] <tantek>
eventprop = *(
- [03:32:40] <tantek>
; the following are optional,
- [03:32:40] <tantek>
; but MUST NOT occur more than once
- [03:32:40] <tantek>
class / created / description / dtstart / geo /
- [03:32:40] <tantek>
last-mod / location
- [03:32:45] <tantek>
once
- [03:33:02] <tantek>
from 4.6.1 Event Component
- [03:33:02] <tantek>
of RFC 2445
- [03:33:52] <DanC>
the year-in-flights meme on flickr seemed to be powered by the great circle mapper. http://gc.kls2.com/faq.html
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- [03:40:49] <mfbot>
[[directions-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=directions-examples&diff=0&oldid=17700 * DanC * (+310) a couple year-in-flights examples
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- [06:42:55] <tantek>
good evening
- [06:43:16] * tantek is writing the "turns 2" blog post
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[[rest/description]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rest/description&diff=0&oldid=17701 * UdrO2s * (-156)
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- [07:21:04] <mfbot>
[[rest/description]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rest/description&diff=0&oldid=17702 * Tantek * (+156) Reverted edit of UdrO2s, changed back to last version by DrErnie
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[[hcard-parsing-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-parsing-fr&diff=0&oldid=17703 * FosBri * (-22753)
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[[hcard-parsing-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-parsing-fr&diff=0&oldid=17704 * Tantek * (+22753) Reverted edit of FosBri, changed back to last version by Tantek
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[[suggested-reading]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=suggested-reading&diff=0&oldid=17705 * OdbEr8 * (-894)
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[[xfolk-scuttle]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=xfolk-scuttle&diff=0&oldid=17706 * Np9I44 * (-2724)
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- [14:11:49] <mfbot>
[[xfolk-scuttle]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=xfolk-scuttle&diff=0&oldid=17707 * Tantek * (+2724) Reverted edit of Np9I44, changed back to last version by RyanKing
- [14:12:30] <mfbot>
[[suggested-reading]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=suggested-reading&diff=0&oldid=17708 * Tantek * (+894) Reverted edit of OdbEr8, changed back to last version by Tantek
- [14:12:41] <mfbot>
[[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) blocked "User:OdbEr8" with an expiry time of infinite: damage/spam
- [14:12:47] <mfbot>
[[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) blocked "User:Np9I44" with an expiry time of infinite: damage/spam
- [14:13:03] <mfbot>
[[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) blocked "User:FosBri" with an expiry time of infinite: damage/spam
- [14:13:16] <tantek>
...
- [14:13:45] <tantek>
There's just something awesome about the fact that the first two comments on the microformats.org turns 2 post are in Danish and Portuguese (I think).
- [14:20:53] <trovster>
Can't believe it's two years... I remember being in here when you were posting about ONE year!
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[[hatom-hints]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-hints&diff=0&oldid=17709 * GvtKs6 * (-4162)
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- [15:26:52] <mfbot>
[[hcard-examples-in-wild]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-examples-in-wild&diff=0&oldid=17710 * Kevin * (+96) New Examples -
- [15:27:03] <mfbot>
[[hatom-hints]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hatom-hints&diff=0&oldid=17711 * Tantek * (+4162) Reverted edit of GvtKs6, changed back to last version by Tantek
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[[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) blocked "User:GvtKs6" with an expiry time of infinite: damage/spam
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- [15:37:24] <mfbot>
[[xfolk-scuttle]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=xfolk-scuttle&diff=0&oldid=17712 * CxtU75 * (-2724)
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- [16:45:42] <mfbot>
[[xfolk-scuttle]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=xfolk-scuttle&diff=0&oldid=17713 * Tantek * (+2724) Reverted edit of CxtU75, changed back to last version by Tantek
- [16:45:58] <mfbot>
[[Special:Log/block]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/block&diff=0&oldid=0 * Tantek * (+0) blocked "User:CxtU75" with an expiry time of infinite: damage/spam
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- [17:20:09] <ianloic>
join #atom
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- [17:33:31] <dzhus>
http://services.alphaworks.ibm.com/manyeyes/view/S5StDHsOtha65okbDIpHH2-
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- [19:45:33] <mfbot>
[[irc-people]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=irc-people&diff=0&oldid=17714 * SarahWorsham * (+46)
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- [20:03:53] <mfbot>
[[advocacy]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=advocacy&diff=0&oldid=17715 * AndyMabbett * (+221) Geo - Great Circle Mapper
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- [20:11:24] <mfbot>
[[advocacy]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=advocacy&diff=0&oldid=17716 * AndyMabbett * (-9252) moving hCard
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- [20:13:50] <mfbot>
[[advocacy]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=advocacy&diff=0&oldid=17717 * AndyMabbett * (-2280) hCard Successes - moving
- [20:14:15] <mfbot>
[[advocacy]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=advocacy&diff=0&oldid=17718 * AndyMabbett * (+0) Successes -
- [20:14:31] <mfbot>
[[hcard-advocacy]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard-advocacy * AndyMabbett * (+11629) moved to sub-divide long page
- [20:16:02] <mfbot>
[[Template:hcard-related-pages]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:hcard-related-pages&diff=0&oldid=17719 * AndyMabbett * (+0) dab
- [20:17:04] <mfbot>
[[hcard-advocacy]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-advocacy&diff=0&oldid=17720 * AndyMabbett * (-125) Successes - rm old markers
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- [20:58:35] <bewest>
will there be a microformats turns 2 party?
- [20:58:48] <bewest>
Derrick says he really liked the micro desserts from last year
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- [21:25:45] <DerrickPallas>
@bewest: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plagiarism
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- [23:31:41] <mfbot>
[[shirts]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/shirts * Tantek * (+42)
- [23:32:57] <mfbot>
[[shirt]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/shirt * Tantek * (+42)
- [23:33:28] <mfbot>
[[tshirt]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/tshirt * Tantek * (+42)
- [23:33:44] <mfbot>
[[tshirts]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/tshirts * Tantek * (+42)
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- [23:38:30] <mfbot>
[[hresume-issues]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hresume-issues&diff=0&oldid=17721 * Steve Ganz * (+424) Issues - Adding rel-tag on 'skills' issue
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These logs were automatically created by mflogbot on
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