IRC Log for #openid on 2007-01-11

Timestamps are in UTC.

  1. [00:28:13] * hikar116 (n=hikari_e@host86-128-46-89.range86-128.btcentralplus.com) has joined #openid
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  9. [02:48:02] <jibot> xlarrydrebes is yet another Janrain idler.
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  38. [16:30:26] * PatF (i=Patrick@nat/novell/x-5cbba3786b0644a1) has joined #openid
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  41. [16:38:50] <jibot> xlarrydrebes is yet another Janrain idler.
  42. [16:43:59] * myren (n=myren@63.231.83.177) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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  45. [17:08:44] <GabeW> ok, well
  46. [17:18:36] * hikar453 (n=hikari_e@host86-144-22-26.range86-144.btcentralplus.com) has joined #openid
  47. [17:19:45] * rokerr (n=rowan@38.99.162.187) has joined #openid
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  59. [18:41:21] * cygnus (n=cygnus@c-71-236-228-127.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  60. [18:41:22] <jibot> cygnus is WorkerBee(name="Jonathan Daugherty", company="JanRain, Inc.")
  61. [18:43:12] * hikar453 (n=hikari_e@host86-144-22-26.range86-144.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  62. [18:47:28] <rorek> jibot, you destroy xchat's distinction between dark red and bright red
  63. [18:48:50] <rorek> Aha, I finally got annoyed enough to figure out how to fix that
  64. [18:49:07] <cygnus> heh
  65. [19:04:46] <_keturn> rorek: oh yeah? how?
  66. [19:05:31] * daleolds (n=daleolds@olds.nu) Quit ("bye")
  67. [19:11:22] * daleold1 (n=daleolds@olds.nu) has joined #openid
  68. [19:13:20] <rorek> _keturn, settings -> preferences: chatting -> general: nicks not to highlight on
  69. [19:15:15] * _keturn sets it, but isn't really sure it does the thing he wants it to do
  70. [19:15:22] <_keturn> I'm worried that just applies to blue, not red
  71. [19:16:29] <rorek> make jibot talk, I'll look away
  72. [19:17:18] <rorek> oh, right, it will highlight on your message nevermind
  73. [19:17:22] * osuguy (n=wizard54@c-67-163-240-184.hsd1.oh.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  74. [19:17:40] <osuguy> hey everyone
  75. [19:17:54] <cygnus> howdy
  76. [19:18:22] <osuguy> i have a question
  77. [19:18:30] <rorek> shoot
  78. [19:18:44] <osuguy> i'm looking at implementing open id, in some sites
  79. [19:19:01] <osuguy> it seems like the security nugs haven't been worked out yet
  80. [19:19:14] <osuguy> bugs*
  81. [19:19:48] <osuguy> can't browser hijacks auto-register sites?
  82. [19:20:13] <rorek> how?
  83. [19:20:16] <osuguy> ok
  84. [19:20:17] <osuguy> example
  85. [19:21:29] <osuguy> www.openidnewsite.com accepts openid.. when the suer enters their id, a javascript refresh (or some type of forward) brings up the openid server's accept/deny for the user to select
  86. [19:21:51] <osuguy> couldn't the site just forward the action to the site as the accept link
  87. [19:24:51] <rorek> If the server were poorly implemented, yes
  88. [19:25:01] <rorek> this is the same problem discussed here: http://brianellin.com/blog/2006/12/11/i-hope-you-like-mannequin/
  89. [19:25:07] <osuguy> thanks
  90. [19:25:21] <osuguy> i looked, just couldn't find anything
  91. [19:28:14] <_keturn> yeah. The most common name for that type of attack seems to be "cross-site request forgery." Certainly wasn't a phrase I knew to search for before someone made a note of it on Brian's blog there.
  92. [19:28:29] <osuguy> haha
  93. [19:28:41] <osuguy> now one last question (maybe)
  94. [19:29:04] <osuguy> i can;t seem to find any info on and specs for something i saw, I think. a messaging or notification function of openid
  95. [19:29:37] <osuguy> so the sites can send messages to users
  96. [19:30:37] <rorek> XSRF?
  97. [19:30:45] <rorek> has a number of ghits. appears to be a legit acronym.
  98. [19:30:59] * SamRose (n=chatzill@brick.voyager.net) Quit ("Chatzilla 0.9.77 [Firefox 1.5.0.9/0000000000]")
  99. [19:32:02] <_keturn> osuguy: see "Data Transport Protocol" on http://openid.net/specs.bml . There was a tech demo of it someplace, but it hasn't really taken off yet.
  100. [19:32:51] <osuguy> _keturn thank you very much
  101. [19:33:03] <osuguy> just trying to get this ready for a presentation
  102. [19:33:17] <osuguy> do you see large sites such as myspace and youtube using openid?
  103. [19:35:01] <gregh> livejournal does! :)
  104. [19:35:06] <_keturn> well, http://kveton.com/blog/2007/01/04/2007-openid-predictions/ has "Big Player Adopts OpenID"
  105. [19:35:16] <osuguy> i saw that
  106. [19:35:22] <osuguy> i hope, it's great stuff
  107. [19:35:47] <osuguy> i've been looking at microsofts stuff, but i think it's way too complicated for the regular user, and no mac/linux access
  108. [19:35:54] <osuguy> cardspace or something
  109. [19:36:16] <rorek> those suckers are going down. ;)
  110. [19:36:40] <osuguy> i think so, it's just passport all over again
  111. [19:36:40] * brianellin (n=brianell@c-71-236-228-127.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit ("Leaving")
  112. [19:37:03] <osuguy> and what 75% of servers are lamp.. what are they thinking basing it on .net
  113. [19:37:11] <rorek> not quite, but I think many will see it as such.
  114. [19:37:20] <_keturn> saying it's "passport all over again" is a mistake, I think. And they are rolling out PHP implementations.
  115. [19:37:47] <osuguy> _keturn .. really. but only for vista customers right?
  116. [19:38:19] <osuguy> and it's still "big brother" managing it all right?
  117. [19:38:22] <_keturn> Have you seen the past few posts on Kim's blog?
  118. [19:38:34] <osuguy> no i have not can you give me a link?
  119. [19:38:49] <_keturn> http://www.identityblog.com/?p=650
  120. [19:39:20] <osuguy> great thanks
  121. [19:40:15] <osuguy> are some of you janrain guys?
  122. [19:41:21] <_keturn> yeah, rorek and I and about a half-dozen others in here are
  123. [19:41:34] <osuguy> i'm thinking about flying out for the event on the 17th
  124. [19:41:41] <osuguy> i'm in columbus ohio.
  125. [19:42:04] <osuguy> are you the main developers behind the openid standard?
  126. [19:42:18] <osuguy> (hard to tell, i see a convergence, but not officially)
  127. [19:42:38] <rorek> j3h is one of the spec's authors
  128. [19:42:54] <osuguy> oh great, than i can push my agenda ahaha
  129. [19:43:00] <osuguy> then8
  130. [19:43:03] <cygnus> sure you can. :)
  131. [19:43:05] <osuguy> i need to learn to type
  132. [19:43:06] <rorek> good luck!
  133. [19:43:25] <rorek> you and countless others....
  134. [19:43:30] <osuguy> i think it's pretty much the same agenda that's already moving forward
  135. [19:43:56] <_keturn> that's quite a flight for our little afternoon event, but you're certainly welcome
  136. [19:44:22] <osuguy> this is a big deal, i see this as the next revolution.
  137. [19:44:31] <osuguy> it ahs to be done, sooner or later
  138. [19:44:33] <osuguy> has*
  139. [19:45:06] <gregh> my passwords file is hundreds of lines long now. yeah, its time has come. :)
  140. [19:46:00] * cygnus looks for gregh's passwords file
  141. [19:46:03] <osuguy> haha
  142. [19:46:24] <cygnus> no hits from google.
  143. [19:46:58] <gregh> sorry, I meant it's hundreds of lines long after you gpg --decrypt it. :p
  144. [19:47:05] <cygnus> suuuuure. :)
  145. [19:48:44] <osuguy> will openid support cardspace (at this point, i can't tell how dumb that question is)
  146. [19:49:36] <myren> cardspace may someday support openid
  147. [19:49:56] <myren> openid is an implementation. cardspace is actually admirally generic.
  148. [19:50:05] <osuguy> gotcha
  149. [19:50:37] <osuguy> so this won't ever be a openid "killer"
  150. [19:50:43] <_keturn> and it might make sense for your OpenID provider to allow you to use Information Cards for credentials
  151. [19:50:43] <osuguy> just a different implementation
  152. [19:50:50] <osuguy> ok
  153. [19:51:12] <osuguy> oh i get it.
  154. [19:52:54] <osuguy> so it will just secure openid that much more, it's not really a "social" program
  155. [19:52:56] <_keturn> I think OpenID provides at least one thing Information Cards don't, which is a consistant URL identifier to use in all your social networking contexts. In some applications, that's important. Others, not so much.
  156. [19:53:23] <myren> addressability is god
  157. [19:53:23] <chowells79> Also take a look at the Higgins project, for something else that's trying to work at the same level as Cardspace (and compatibly), but multi-platform..
  158. [19:53:53] <osuguy> ok
  159. [20:11:25] <PatF> #higgins
  160. [20:12:54] <PatF> I just talked to David on Monday about integrating higgins with openid, this would allow infocards to work with an openid idp
  161. [20:12:58] <PatF> fyi
  162. [20:13:48] <osuguy> nice
  163. [20:14:24] <osuguy> i keep seeing yahoo's bbauth everywhere, any thoughts on where that's heading?
  164. [20:14:41] <osuguy> it seems like the internet will be a second level of disaster
  165. [20:14:42] <osuguy> heh
  166. [20:15:01] <osuguy> first was l/p now, twenty different protocols to manange them
  167. [20:15:02] <PatF> and googles checkout
  168. [20:15:06] <PatF> looks like passport to me
  169. [20:15:20] <osuguy> checkout is more like 2checkout.com
  170. [20:15:46] <osuguy> http://theurer.cc/code/sso/ is what got me thinking about bbauth
  171. [20:30:41] * lucasvo (n=lucasvo@wservices.ch) has left #openid
  172. [20:32:19] <rorek> someone should write an app to turn google and yahoo accounts into openids
  173. [20:33:11] <chowells79> Actually, that sounds fun for the mashpit, if no one's got anything better to do...
  174. [20:33:23] * rorek places his finger on the side of his nose (the universal sign for not-it)
  175. [20:33:49] <chowells79> Just make sure you've got something better to do. :)
  176. [20:34:47] <rorek> Actually it doesn't seem all that bad. I just have a ton of half-finished projects already
  177. [20:35:12] <rorek> (that I wasn't paid to do)
  178. [20:44:17] * mpg4 (n=mpg4@c-71-236-228-127.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  179. [20:46:09] <_keturn> um, meep.
  180. [20:46:14] <_keturn> j3h: seen http://www.butterfat.net/wiki/Projects/ModAuthOpenID ?
  181. [20:46:23] <_keturn> (hooray it is C++)
  182. [20:47:07] <PatF> client library?
  183. [20:47:53] <_keturn> yeah, using libopkele
  184. [20:47:59] <PatF> nice
  185. [20:58:04] * xlarrydrebes_ (n=xlarrydr@c-71-236-228-127.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  186. [20:58:04] <jibot> xlarrydrebes_ is icechat's dirty little nuisance.
  187. [21:02:23] * hikari_esblogger (n=hikari_e@host86-146-200-173.range86-146.btcentralplus.com) Quit (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable))
  188. [21:15:38] <osuguy> how does openid work for ecommerce sites? any support?
  189. [21:18:15] <rorek> Quoting myself earlier, the main trouble is that there's not a trust architecture for openid, so one doesn't necessarily know if a user's IDP is secure. IDP whitelists could work for this.
  190. [21:18:30] <_keturn> that question is a little too broad for me to figure out where to start
  191. [21:23:19] <cygnus> xb
  192. [21:23:23] <cygnus> er, whoops
  193. [21:23:53] <gregh> better change your password now
  194. [21:28:09] * xlarrydrebes (n=xlarrydr@c-71-236-228-127.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit ("The computer fell asleep")
  195. [21:29:11] <_keturn> if the question was "should I distribute my CC# through my OpenID provider", the answer is "very cautiously." If the question was "should I distribute my paypal ID through my OpenID provider", that's probably pretty reasonable
  196. [21:29:35] <_keturn> if the question was "does anyone have a product that uses OpenID to replace CC#s," I don't think so
  197. [21:32:20] * daleolds (n=daleolds@olds.nu) has joined #openid
  198. [21:33:07] * daleold1 (n=daleolds@olds.nu) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  199. [21:45:07] <osuguy> ok thanks guys, i know my question was broad
  200. [21:54:00] * hober (n=ted@unaffiliated/hober) has joined #openid
  201. [22:03:37] * cote (n=cote@adsl-71-145-201-13.dsl.austtx.sbcglobal.net) Quit ()
  202. [22:09:12] * rokerr (n=rowan@38.99.162.187) Quit ()
  203. [22:25:47] * whitehat (n=whitehat@unaffiliated/whitehat) has joined #openid
  204. [22:48:35] * sipher (i=sipher@unaffiliated/sipher) has joined #openid
  205. [22:49:13] <sipher> What's the license on the openid.net logo?
  206. [22:52:26] * PatF (i=Patrick@nat/novell/x-5cbba3786b0644a1) has left #openid
  207. [23:04:10] * daleold1 (n=daleolds@olds.nu) has joined #openid
  208. [23:04:10] * daleolds (n=daleolds@olds.nu) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  209. [23:07:31] * cygnus` (n=cygnus@71.236.228.127) has joined #openid
  210. [23:07:46] <sipher> Why was it decided to use a seperate URL identifier instead of just a unique URL of the idP? example.com/someblog/ instead of id.example.com/someuser/? What happens if someone successfuly performs a XSS attack and changes the id server for someblog? All their logins are compromised..
  211. [23:08:06] * cygnus (n=cygnus@c-71-236-228-127.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit (Nick collision from services.)
  212. [23:08:16] * cygnus` is now known as cygnus
  213. [23:08:30] * cygnus` (n=cygnus@c-71-236-228-127.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  214. [23:09:44] <sipher> or a more pressing question.. if a man speaks in IRC but nobody's around but lurkers.. does he make a sound? :p
  215. [23:10:10] <osuguy> if i knew the answer, i would have told you haha no idea
  216. [23:11:21] * cote (n=cote@72-48-75-181.dyn.grandenetworks.net) has joined #openid
  217. [23:11:48] <gregh> sipher: with the extra level of indirection, you can switch identity providers without changing your identity url
  218. [23:13:19] <hober> Besides which, it's much easier for me to remember (in my case) edward.oconnor.cx than, err, whatever my delegate is.
  219. [23:13:32] <GabeW> thats not it
  220. [23:13:39] <GabeW> woops
  221. [23:13:41] <GabeW> wrongs channel
  222. [23:16:41] <sipher> ah. I see.
  223. [23:18:44] <sipher> I'm planning to run my own server so remembering it wouldn't be hard for me.. just id.mydomain.com.. and the problem of switching id providers could be easily solved for people with DNS access by just adding a CNAME
  224. [23:19:44] <sipher> The users it wouldn't accomodate would be like blogspot users etc.
  225. [23:20:02] <gregh> which would be most of them :)
  226. [23:20:10] <sipher> Unless blogspot added it..
  227. [23:22:02] <sipher> It just seems kind of sloppy to me to rely on the integrity of the markup at the URL id
  228. [23:22:23] <sipher> and inefficient
  229. [23:24:51] <sipher> The OpenID scheme is still brilliant
  230. [23:27:47] <GabeW> that compliment is publicly logged ;-)
  231. [23:29:29] <sipher> I was making an effort to ignore it in all my feeds.. thinking it was more "Web 2.0" hype.. but it's not. :)
  232. [23:30:55] <_keturn> effort(ignorance) > effort(adoption) ? success!
  233. [23:33:10] <sipher> So nobody knows the license status of the openid.net logo?
  234. [23:33:42] <GabeW> I don't - we've been discussing an update for 2.0 but I'm not sure where that is
  235. [23:38:18] * rorek (n=sanedrag@c-71-236-228-127.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
  236. [23:38:25] * rorek (n=sanedrag@c-71-236-228-127.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  237. [23:42:37] <osuguy> question, what if a user.. say at livejournal, wants to switch to myopenid.com's system. can they make livejournal use the new account?
  238. [23:43:34] <gregh> possibly, by changing their journal "style" through lj
  239. [23:43:57] <osuguy> ok
  240. [23:44:50] * PatF (n=Patrick@c-67-177-32-91.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  241. [23:44:54] * PatF (n=Patrick@c-67-177-32-91.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  242. [23:45:21] <osuguy> maybe a migration request could be added to the new spec
  243. [23:45:43] * tnarg (n=grant@c-71-236-228-127.hsd1.or.comcast.net) Quit ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  244. [23:48:56] <GabeW> http://partnernetwork.visa.com/pf/3dsec/download/trk_3dsec_system_overview_v102.pdf
  245. [23:55:33] * daleold1 (n=daleolds@olds.nu) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  246. [23:57:32] * daleolds (n=daleolds@olds.nu) has joined #openid
  247. [23:57:41] * whitehat (n=whitehat@unaffiliated/whitehat) has left #openid
  248. [23:57:55] <osuguy> GabeW, never seen that before, crazy
  249. [23:58:52] <GabeW> yah, well, openid isn't exactly breaking new ground in many ways - whats new is the ultra-lightness and internet-scaleness
  250. [23:59:48] * veeliam (n=veeliam@207.111.252.38) has left #openid
  251. [23:59:59] <osuguy> GabeW you are talking about the visa product?

These logs were automatically created by OpenIDlogbot on chat.freenode.net using a modified version of the Java IRC LogBot.