IRC Log for #openid on 2007-10-04

Timestamps are in UTC.

  1. [00:09:57] * tessier_ (n=treed@kernel-panic/sex-machines) has joined #openid
  2. [00:10:25] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) Quit ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  3. [00:12:00] * Melvster (n=chatzill@87.151.15.192) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  4. [00:38:02] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #openid
  5. [00:42:24] * jeffmcneill (n=jeffmcne@66.162.254.21) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  6. [00:42:34] * cote (n=cote@wsip-70-165-207-230.lv.lv.cox.net) Quit ()
  7. [00:46:49] * tessier_ (n=treed@kernel-panic/sex-machines) has left #openid
  8. [00:47:25] * Skwid_ (n=Skwid___@bas1-montreal42-1242354404.dsl.bell.ca) has joined #openid
  9. [00:47:25] <jibot> Skwid_ is cool
  10. [00:50:39] * AaronF (n=AaronF@wsip-68-15-8-102.sd.sd.cox.net) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  11. [00:56:10] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) Quit ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  12. [01:02:16] * cote (n=cote@wsip-68-110-33-208.lv.lv.cox.net) has joined #openid
  13. [01:36:17] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #openid
  14. [01:36:39] * Melvster__ (n=chatzill@87.151.14.25) has joined #openid
  15. [01:36:41] * Melvster__ is now known as Melvster
  16. [01:39:51] * cote (n=cote@wsip-68-110-33-208.lv.lv.cox.net) Quit ()
  17. [01:43:04] * cote (n=cote@wsip-68-110-33-208.lv.lv.cox.net) has joined #openid
  18. [01:44:20] * cote (n=cote@wsip-68-110-33-208.lv.lv.cox.net) Quit (Client Quit)
  19. [01:50:15] * cote (n=cote@wsip-68-110-33-208.lv.lv.cox.net) has joined #openid
  20. [01:54:32] * Melvster_ (n=chatzill@87.151.15.192) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  21. [01:58:13] * Skwid_ (n=Skwid___@bas1-montreal42-1242354404.dsl.bell.ca) Quit ("Quitte")
  22. [01:58:17] * shigeta (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) has joined #openid
  23. [02:05:42] * cote (n=cote@wsip-68-110-33-208.lv.lv.cox.net) Quit ()
  24. [02:34:13] * stub (n=stub@ppp-58.8.4.60.revip2.asianet.co.th) has joined #openid
  25. [02:51:03] * cote (n=cote@wsip-68-110-33-208.lv.lv.cox.net) has joined #openid
  26. [04:00:48] * jeffmcneill (n=jeffmcne@66.162.254.21) has joined #openid
  27. [04:04:35] * jeremyb (n=jeremy@unaffiliated/jeremyb) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  28. [04:04:41] * jeremyb (n=jeremy@unaffiliated/jeremyb) has joined #openid
  29. [04:28:21] * dcorbin (n=dcorbin@adsl-068-209-008-148.sip.asm.bellsouth.net) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  30. [04:32:32] * dcorbin (n=dcorbin@adsl-068-209-008-148.sip.asm.bellsouth.net) has joined #openid
  31. [04:41:41] * cote (n=cote@wsip-68-110-33-208.lv.lv.cox.net) Quit ()
  32. [04:49:08] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  33. [04:54:32] * idnar (i=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar) Quit (Nick collision from services.)
  34. [04:54:35] * idnar_ (i=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar) has joined #openid
  35. [05:04:14] * cote (n=cote@wsip-70-165-207-230.lv.lv.cox.net) has joined #openid
  36. [05:07:44] * shigeta (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) Quit ()
  37. [05:10:07] * Melvster (n=chatzill@87.151.14.25) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  38. [05:30:04] * GabeW is ever-so-slightly inebriated
  39. [05:30:24] <GabeW> and i really didn't mean to let this channel know that
  40. [05:41:39] * SvenDowideit (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) has joined #openid
  41. [05:53:15] * shigeta (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) has joined #openid
  42. [06:01:30] * SvenDowideit_ (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) has joined #openid
  43. [06:02:40] * Loolyan87 (i=Al@gateway/tor/x-76128fd1443d0ae6) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  44. [06:10:14] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) has joined #openid
  45. [06:17:23] * SvenDowideit (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) Quit (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable))
  46. [06:46:30] * SvenDowideit__ (n=SvenDowi@124-171-31-139.dyn.iinet.net.au) has joined #openid
  47. [06:53:47] * tbbrown_ (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) has joined #openid
  48. [07:01:20] * SvenDowideit_ (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) Quit (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable))
  49. [07:11:10] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  50. [07:13:51] * pvandewyngaerde (n=pvandewy@250.77-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) has joined #openid
  51. [07:31:27] * SvenDowideit (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) has joined #openid
  52. [07:45:51] * SvenDowideit__ (n=SvenDowi@124-171-31-139.dyn.iinet.net.au) Quit (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable))
  53. [07:59:47] * SvenDowideit_ (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) has joined #openid
  54. [08:10:16] * Loolyan87 (i=Al@gateway/tor/x-407986292149b6fa) has joined #openid
  55. [08:15:50] * SvenDowideit (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) Quit (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable))
  56. [08:21:38] * niarc (n=niarc@87.118.68.60) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  57. [08:36:05] * niarc (n=niarc@87.118.68.60) has joined #openid
  58. [08:52:35] * SvenDowideit_ (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) Quit ("Leaving")
  59. [08:53:38] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) Quit ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  60. [09:05:13] * idnar (i=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar) has joined #openid
  61. [09:06:33] * l0gic (n=l0gic@84.91.8.225) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  62. [09:07:23] * l0gic (n=l0gic@84.91.8.225) has joined #openid
  63. [09:12:37] * digitalspaghetti (n=digitals@host217-37-122-77.in-addr.btopenworld.com) has joined #openid
  64. [09:13:27] * idnar_ (i=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  65. [09:29:22] * Loolyan87 (i=Al@gateway/tor/x-407986292149b6fa) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  66. [09:38:32] * Mitsurugi (n=Nightmar@156.Red-81-44-38.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  67. [09:39:06] * peace-keeper (n=peace-ke@M886P001.adsl.highway.telekom.at) has joined #openid
  68. [09:45:09] * Loolyan87 (i=Al@gateway/tor/x-2c8d35ca5ce99043) has joined #openid
  69. [10:29:16] * Lazy (n=Glow41@80.184.67.178) has joined #openID
  70. [10:29:16] <jibot> Lazy is good
  71. [10:29:50] <Lazy> hello , can i ask questions here ?
  72. [10:48:41] * Lazy (n=Glow41@80.184.67.178) Quit ("GlowNdark Script @ http://GlowNdark.hypermart.net/")
  73. [10:53:55] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) has joined #openid
  74. [10:57:45] * pvandewyngaerde (n=pvandewy@250.77-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  75. [10:59:55] * pvandewyngaerde (n=pvandewy@250.77-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) has joined #openid
  76. [11:03:41] * tbbrown_ (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  77. [11:21:17] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  78. [11:26:13] * marclaporte (n=Marc_Lap@tikiwiki/marclaporte) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  79. [11:26:18] * marclaport1 (n=Marc_Lap@bas3-montreal02-1096682641.dsl.bell.ca) has joined #openid
  80. [11:38:30] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) has joined #openid
  81. [11:38:36] * stub (n=stub@canonical/launchpad/stub) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  82. [12:12:55] * shigeta (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) has left #openid
  83. [12:52:53] * Mitsurugi (n=Nightmar@204.Red-83-61-236.staticIP.rima-tde.net) has joined #openID
  84. [12:56:50] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  85. [12:57:30] * pvandewyngaerde (n=pvandewy@250.77-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) Quit (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
  86. [12:57:34] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) has joined #openid
  87. [13:42:24] <openid_pibb> <wizardwatson> No.
  88. [13:42:44] <openid_pibb> <wizardwatson> Oh, wait! I answered one, damn it!!
  89. [13:46:51] * Melvster (n=chatzill@p57970E19.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #openid
  90. [14:01:49] * peace-keeper (n=peace-ke@M886P001.adsl.highway.telekom.at) Quit (Connection timed out)
  91. [14:43:02] <Melvster> from the openID book:
  92. [14:44:03] <Melvster> Note that it is possible to have your browser machine also acting as the OpenID identity provider. In that scenario there are only 2 machines taking part in the communication.
  93. [14:44:10] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #openid
  94. [14:44:56] <Melvster> Does that mean openID can work just via your PC?
  95. [14:51:15] <keturn> I don't see a way for that to work unless your PC is running a web server with a public IP
  96. [14:56:33] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) Quit ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  97. [15:03:24] <Melvster> got it
  98. [15:03:49] <Melvster> i guess that's a possibility
  99. [15:11:13] * ichigo (n=ichigo@chello062178051055.18.11.vie.surfer.at) has joined #openid
  100. [15:45:39] * SamRose (n=chatzill@brick.voyager.net) has joined #openid
  101. [15:54:43] * benj3one (n=ben@adsl-75-41-185-190.dsl.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net) has joined #openid
  102. [16:18:35] * pvandewyngaerde (n=pvandewy@26.102-245-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) has joined #openid
  103. [16:29:29] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #openid
  104. [16:35:33] * rkerr (n=rowan@CPE0016cbc69125-CM0011ae91b176.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #openid
  105. [16:40:29] * don-o tries Apalachian one more time
  106. [16:54:22] * cote (n=cote@wsip-70-165-207-230.lv.lv.cox.net) Quit ()
  107. [17:05:03] <don-o> woah, once i got rid of firebug, Apalachain started working.
  108. [17:08:58] <trel1023> interesting - may want to report that
  109. [17:15:51] * digitalspaghetti (n=digitals@host217-37-122-77.in-addr.btopenworld.com) Quit ()
  110. [17:16:19] <don-o> yeah. the plugin, once i learned how to use it, is rather interesting.
  111. [17:41:37] <Melvster> hmm
  112. [17:41:52] <Melvster> i wonder if i can live without firebug
  113. [17:43:23] * Melvster (n=chatzill@p57970E19.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.7/2007091417]")
  114. [17:45:09] * pvandewyngaerde (n=pvandewy@26.102-245-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) Quit ("http://www.last.fm/user/pvandewyngaerde/ http://www.jamendo.com http://amarok.kde.org/")
  115. [17:46:41] * Melvster (n=chatzill@p57970E19.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #openid
  116. [17:46:50] <don-o> i think they both want that lower right corner spot for their icon
  117. [17:47:02] <Melvster> ah - didnt work for me even w/o firebug
  118. [17:53:33] <don-o> Melvster: do you get the (@) logo ?
  119. [17:53:54] <don-o> in the lower-right corner
  120. [17:54:14] <Melvster> no logo at all
  121. [17:54:49] <don-o> Melvster: start pulling out more plugins. :)
  122. [17:55:07] <Melvster> :)
  123. [17:55:29] <Melvster> have too many, ill have to try it on another machine
  124. [17:56:01] <Melvster> ive got 10 laptop, i think one of them has a clean FF installation :)
  125. [17:57:55] <Melvster> have you built your own Consumer?
  126. [17:58:06] <Melvster> i should call it Relying Party i guess
  127. [17:59:04] * cote (n=cote@63.164.47.227) has joined #openid
  128. [18:00:05] <don-o> me? i created a rails app last year that was an RP.
  129. [18:00:26] <don-o> meaning it used the janrain gems. not a custom implementation
  130. [18:01:03] <Melvster> ah ok, was it hard, im going to try and create a consumer
  131. [18:01:16] <Melvster> eventually i want to plug it into some standard login forms
  132. [18:01:57] <don-o> the hard part, i feel, is deciding what to do when an existing name/pass users logs in with an openid url for the first time
  133. [18:02:25] <don-o> ma.gnolia.com is the first site ive seen that tries to associate the two.
  134. [18:03:16] <Melvster> hmm i see
  135. [18:03:25] <Melvster> i was thinking give all of my current users an openid
  136. [18:03:46] <don-o> my solution was to only allow openid logins
  137. [18:04:00] <Melvster> would love to do that
  138. [18:04:06] <Melvster> but im pretty sure people would get confused
  139. [18:04:34] <don-o> it was easy on my site because it had maybe 5 users total :)
  140. [18:05:02] <Melvster> hmm i got 2000 but i bet most of them are spambots
  141. [18:05:16] <Melvster> they're not tech savvy unfort.
  142. [18:06:17] <Melvster> i guess i can allow users to load up a set of openids in their profile
  143. [18:06:24] * marclaport1 (n=Marc_Lap@bas3-montreal02-1096682641.dsl.bell.ca) has left #openid
  144. [18:06:24] <Melvster> then when i see one come in, i know it's them
  145. [18:07:21] <Melvster> of course when i add openid, you wont need a spambot, it's going to be war :)
  146. [18:10:53] <GabeW> quick insta-survey
  147. [18:11:04] <GabeW> folks here: are you working on consumers or providers, or neither
  148. [18:11:15] <Melvster> both
  149. [18:11:15] <GabeW> ?
  150. [18:11:19] <Melvster> consumer right now
  151. [18:11:28] <GabeW> i should say "RP"
  152. [18:11:41] <GabeW> are you writing code, or integratin with a specific site?
  153. [18:11:52] <GabeW> that is - working on a package or a site?
  154. [18:12:01] <Melvster> first step is integration, but i may have to dive into the code
  155. [18:12:24] <GabeW> but are you producing open source like drupal, or integrating with a specific site?
  156. [18:12:51] <Melvster> open source where possible, but my first target is to openenable the sites i already have
  157. [18:12:55] <GabeW> ok
  158. [18:13:02] <GabeW> so primarily making those sites RPs?
  159. [18:13:21] <Melvster> both
  160. [18:13:22] <GabeW> i'm interested because most of the numbers in the openid world are "supply-side" (OPs)
  161. [18:13:29] <Melvster> site.com/User should be an openid i feel
  162. [18:13:41] <GabeW> there need to be a lot more RPs
  163. [18:13:52] <GabeW> to make the claims of OpenID success really legitimate
  164. [18:14:01] <Melvster> true
  165. [18:14:08] <Melvster> well ive been waiting for the forum addon for ages
  166. [18:14:14] <Melvster> this is phpbb3
  167. [18:14:20] <GabeW> ah
  168. [18:14:23] <Melvster> so ill probably write my own simple version
  169. [18:14:29] <Melvster> im happy to release my code
  170. [18:14:35] <Melvster> but someone is already doing it
  171. [18:14:55] <Melvster> BUT, i think that once you allow openid in a site, you should offer to be an OP too
  172. [18:15:00] <GabeW> depends
  173. [18:15:02] <Melvster> i dont see why you would do one and not the other
  174. [18:15:16] <GabeW> because you don't want to have user credentials at all
  175. [18:15:19] <GabeW> like jyte
  176. [18:15:26] <Melvster> ah i guess so
  177. [18:15:54] <GabeW> or a blog
  178. [18:16:02] <GabeW> where you don't want to be an OP for commenters
  179. [18:16:06] * marclaporte (n=Marc_Lap@tikiwiki/marclaporte) has joined #openid
  180. [18:16:06] <jibot> marclaporte is Marc Laporte from Tiki CMS/Groupware
  181. [18:16:06] <Melvster> true
  182. [18:16:41] <Melvster> the issue is that it's not very simple to add RP to a site
  183. [18:16:55] <GabeW> depends
  184. [18:16:57] <Melvster> im reading the docs now, im sure when i understand it and look back ill think it was easy
  185. [18:17:05] <GabeW> funny though - i think it can be easy
  186. [18:17:11] <GabeW> depending how cleanly user amanagement is done
  187. [18:17:29] <_keturn> from an authentication security perspective, it's because you don't want to keep credentials or implement other auth mechanisms. from an online identity perspective, it's because I don't *want* another OpenID with every site I'm a member of; it kinda goes against the goal.
  188. [18:17:59] <GabeW> _keturn: yah, but if you are a site, you'd like everyone using your brand all over the place (if you are providing yourcoolsite.com/user )
  189. [18:18:15] <Melvster> good point, i just wanted to give my existing users an openid, because the vast majority would not have one
  190. [18:18:20] <GabeW> except maybe you don't want it being used at porn sites?
  191. [18:18:30] <_keturn> GabeW: that's a big "depending."
  192. [18:19:18] <_keturn> Melvster: is there a lot of overlap in userbase between your sites?
  193. [18:19:19] * cote (n=cote@63.164.47.227) Quit ()
  194. [18:19:30] <Melvster> not really
  195. [18:19:36] <Melvster> but i see it in the future
  196. [18:19:59] <Melvster> not my site, but mine and others, (i run a non profit sport forum by the way)
  197. [18:20:36] <Melvster> i wanted my users to get a chance to share ideas with other forums (hence OP) and other to be able to post on us (RP)
  198. [18:20:47] <GabeW> _keturn: the thing I think that should happen with the focus on openid (and other SSO-related protocols) is that user management is going to be a Thing that rises to the level of architecture
  199. [18:20:53] <GabeW> like logging, etc
  200. [18:21:09] <GabeW> and not just an afterthought
  201. [18:21:37] <GabeW> things get reified in archtiectures as developer communities become aware of them as pain points, etc
  202. [18:21:54] <_keturn> it's just that if there were, I could see confusion when a user goes to site A and it says "hi I'm your OpenID provider now" and then they go to site B and it says the same thing
  203. [18:21:59] <GabeW> yah
  204. [18:22:02] <GabeW> thats a good point
  205. [18:22:11] * GabeW mulls over libid
  206. [18:22:18] <GabeW> as in LibIdentity
  207. [18:22:46] <Melvster> libidenity is different from openidentity?
  208. [18:22:52] <GabeW> well
  209. [18:22:53] <GabeW> maybe not
  210. [18:23:01] <GabeW> in which case, its a null hypothesis
  211. [18:23:07] <_keturn> GabeW: I think we're successfully influcing frameworks in that direction, but we're not living in that future yet
  212. [18:23:14] <GabeW> _keturn: right
  213. [18:23:42] * SamRose (n=chatzill@brick.voyager.net) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  214. [18:24:43] <Melvster> yep - digitial identity is just the first step
  215. [18:25:08] <Melvster> once it's widely adopted you'll see a whole bunch of stuff emmerge - probably some you never even imagined too
  216. [18:25:08] <GabeW> and world domination is the ultimate goal
  217. [18:25:15] <Melvster> lol
  218. [18:25:25] <GabeW> its a inverse tree
  219. [18:25:38] <GabeW> where world domination is the ultimate goal of every beginning path
  220. [18:26:00] <GabeW> and its always 42 steps to world domination
  221. [18:26:10] <Melvster> 42?
  222. [18:26:13] <GabeW> 42
  223. [18:26:16] <Melvster> oh i get it
  224. [18:26:21] <Melvster> the question to the answer
  225. [18:26:29] <GabeW> yes
  226. [18:26:46] <GabeW> surprisingly, wikipedia doesn't have an entry on 42
  227. [18:26:52] <GabeW> other than the YEAR 42
  228. [18:28:07] <Melvster> i got one for you
  229. [18:28:17] <Melvster> youve heard of 6 degrees of seperation?
  230. [18:28:31] <GabeW> of course
  231. [18:29:24] <Melvster> lets say you start with a group of people
  232. [18:29:52] <Melvster> hmmm let me think how to phrase this correctly ... one second ...
  233. [18:30:21] * cote (n=cote@63.164.47.227) has joined #openid
  234. [18:30:21] <Melvster> ok lets say you start with a group of people
  235. [18:31:35] <Melvster> hmmm anyway doesnt work anymore
  236. [18:31:43] <Melvster> what i was gonig to so say way
  237. [18:31:54] <Melvster> 42^6 is roughly the world population
  238. [18:32:47] <openid_pibb> <cygnus> quite roughly
  239. [18:32:54] <Melvster> well not anymore
  240. [18:32:58] <Melvster> it used to be though :)
  241. [18:33:05] <Melvster> when i calced it before
  242. [18:33:13] * baughj (n=baughj@fsf/staff/baughj) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  243. [18:33:22] <Melvster> basically lest say everyone knows everyone without overlap with 6 degrees of freedom
  244. [18:33:40] <Melvster> seperation sorry
  245. [18:33:52] <Melvster> what is the average group size of friends
  246. [18:33:56] <Melvster> it used to work out to 42
  247. [18:35:10] <Melvster> i know 42 people
  248. [18:35:17] <Melvster> each of them know 42 others
  249. [18:35:29] <Melvster> that gives 42^2 in 2 degrees
  250. [18:35:35] <Melvster> etc. up to 42^6
  251. [18:36:12] <Melvster> actually no it still holds
  252. [18:36:16] <Melvster> i double counted myself
  253. [18:36:28] <Melvster> if i know 42 other people the first degree is 43
  254. [18:36:56] <Melvster> 43^6 gives 6.3 billion
  255. [18:36:59] <Melvster> cool!
  256. [18:37:53] * peace-keeper (n=peace-ke@81-223-92-227.sechshaus.xdsl-line.inode.at) has joined #openid
  257. [18:37:56] <Melvster> so the question to the answer is: assuming no overlap of friend, how many unique other people does the average person need to know to cover the planet within 6 degrees of seperation
  258. [18:38:05] <Melvster> answer: you need to know 42 people
  259. [18:38:14] <johill> non-overlapping
  260. [18:38:26] <johill> which is quite unlikely
  261. [18:38:31] <GabeW> which is quite a bad assumption
  262. [18:38:34] <GabeW> we are very clumpy
  263. [18:38:40] <johill> exactly
  264. [18:38:53] <Melvster> well it was just a bit of fun :)
  265. [18:39:00] <johill> sure :)
  266. [18:39:04] <Melvster> cliquey i think the term is
  267. [18:40:40] <Melvster> $1m prize to solve the clique finding in graphs problem - a friend of mine tried to do it for years :)
  268. [18:40:57] <johill> heh
  269. [18:41:12] <johill> I forgot, is it one of the clay millenium problems?
  270. [18:41:34] <Melvster> not sure, could be, basically solve any NP complete problem and you get the prize
  271. [18:41:36] <johill> graph theory's rusty. or is it proven NP and hence it's the P=NP problem?
  272. [18:41:40] <Melvster> that was one of them
  273. [18:41:55] <johill> right
  274. [18:42:02] <johill> haven't done graph theory in a while
  275. [18:42:07] <Melvster> nor me :(
  276. [18:42:17] <Melvster> was my favourite at uni
  277. [18:42:28] <Melvster> thats why i like teh openid foaf stuff
  278. [18:43:47] <Melvster> but i think when we get open social networks up and running, that stuff is going to come in REAL handy
  279. [18:44:57] <Melvster> i see massive computing power and bandwidth needed in time to come
  280. [18:45:05] <Melvster> as everyone starts sharing
  281. [18:45:57] <Melvster> right, time to get back to building my Relying party
  282. [18:46:39] <Melvster> is there any issue with using the openID URI as a username?
  283. [18:46:51] <Melvster> or should i say XRI?
  284. [18:47:05] <GabeW> i don't think so
  285. [18:47:11] <GabeW> except it may not be user friendly
  286. [18:47:27] <johill> just don't allow sql injection ;)
  287. [18:47:28] <GabeW> in the sense
  288. [18:47:52] <GabeW> that 3rd parties may not need to be seeing other user's OpenID URL/XRIs
  289. [18:47:53] <johill> I wouldn't use a username at all
  290. [18:48:00] <GabeW> yah
  291. [18:48:07] <GabeW> i probably wouldn't either, if I could avoid it
  292. [18:48:14] <Melvster> hmmmmm
  293. [18:48:16] <johill> people will want some sort of 'nick' but that needs not even be unique
  294. [18:48:18] <GabeW> but it means using their "human friendly name" attribute
  295. [18:48:19] <GabeW> yah
  296. [18:48:24] <GabeW> right
  297. [18:48:27] <GabeW> what johill said
  298. [18:48:37] <Melvster> i think what ill do is this:
  299. [18:48:47] <johill> could show the openid url in parentheses or something
  300. [18:48:53] <GabeW> right
  301. [18:49:01] <Melvster> make an OP of the form <site.com>/username
  302. [18:49:06] <Melvster> for all my users
  303. [18:49:14] <Melvster> if you are from my site ill strip off the front
  304. [18:49:21] <Melvster> if you are from another site ill display the full thing
  305. [18:49:27] <johill> anyway, off, have fun!
  306. [18:49:52] <Melvster> so myopenid.com/alice says:
  307. [18:50:10] <Melvster> i kind of think openid should be, well open
  308. [18:50:39] <Melvster> sort of a real digital identity
  309. [18:51:37] <Melvster> i cant think of a good reason to conceal openids
  310. [18:52:01] <Melvster> except that they may contain strange characters
  311. [18:52:11] <Melvster> or be too long, but them people will learn to get shorter ones
  312. [18:52:17] <Melvster> (then)
  313. [18:52:58] <Melvster> parentheses - that's a good idea, or a mouseover
  314. [18:53:01] <Melvster> like it, thanks
  315. [19:04:10] * cote (n=cote@63.164.47.227) Quit ()
  316. [19:08:39] <Melvster> you know what would make writing a consumer MUCH easier?
  317. [19:08:52] <Melvster> login via openid then get a shared access account
  318. [19:09:19] <Melvster> i think i might implement this first
  319. [19:12:10] * Melvster (n=chatzill@p57970E19.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  320. [19:12:57] * Melvster (n=chatzill@p57970E19.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #openid
  321. [19:15:47] * Melvster (n=chatzill@p57970E19.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  322. [19:19:16] * Melvster (n=chatzill@p57970E19.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #openid
  323. [19:27:15] <Melvster> i think ill send OpenID logins to a guest account to start of with
  324. [19:27:18] * niarc (n=niarc@87.118.68.60) Quit (K-lined)
  325. [19:27:33] <Melvster> should make impl. much easier
  326. [19:54:16] <openid_pibb> <jes5199> exists there currently a wiki farm that consumes openID ?
  327. [19:54:34] <Melvster> yes
  328. [19:54:38] <Melvster> wikitravel.org
  329. [19:54:43] <GabeW> Melvster: answer in yoda-speak
  330. [19:55:04] <Melvster> http://
  331. [19:55:32] <Melvster> or aboutus
  332. [19:55:55] <Melvster> :)
  333. [19:56:46] * Loolyan87 (i=Al@gateway/tor/x-2c8d35ca5ce99043) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  334. [19:59:34] <openid_pibb> <jes5199> great,.. but how about a service that lets users create their own wikis?
  335. [20:01:00] <Melvster> with opendi?
  336. [20:01:03] <Melvster> openid?
  337. [20:03:48] * AaronF (n=AaronF@wsip-68-15-8-102.sd.sd.cox.net) has joined #openid
  338. [20:04:19] <Melvster> sorry dont know of any with openid but there's plenty that let you create a wiki, you can even create a dekiwiki i believe
  339. [20:04:34] <AaronF> huh what?
  340. [20:04:41] <AaronF> Deki wki rules.... ;-)
  341. [20:04:47] <Melvster> it's good
  342. [20:04:52] <AaronF> its the bestest!
  343. [20:04:58] <Melvster> cant wait for mediawiki to catch up
  344. [20:05:03] <AaronF> lol
  345. [20:05:05] <Melvster> does it allow openid?
  346. [20:05:06] <AaronF> that will be difficult
  347. [20:05:13] <AaronF> Not yet. Sorry.
  348. [20:05:16] <AaronF> Soon very soon
  349. [20:05:28] <Melvster> openid_pibb> <jes5199> great,.. but how about a service that lets users create their own wikis?
  350. [20:05:28] <openid_pibb> Melvster: Error: "<jes5199>" is not a valid command.
  351. [20:05:53] <AaronF> well currently we have www.wik.is but that software is 1.5 years older than our current version
  352. [20:05:59] <Melvster> ah yes
  353. [20:06:04] <Melvster> that's the one, id forgotten
  354. [20:06:08] <AaronF> the diff b/w what we run at www.wik.is is actually 5 released
  355. [20:06:10] <AaronF> releases
  356. [20:06:16] <AaronF> BIIIIG diff
  357. [20:06:29] <AaronF> Anyway, we'll be updating that Nov 7-9 somewheere in there
  358. [20:06:53] <Melvster> cool - dekiwiki is great, i just dont yet have mysql5 on my box
  359. [20:07:03] <Melvster> or id get mono and put it on
  360. [20:07:06] <AaronF> Deki Wiki gets over 700 downloads a day and another hundred instantiations at www.wik.is a day
  361. [20:07:11] <Melvster> but i think you need to fiddle with apache too?
  362. [20:07:14] <AaronF> You can run in the VMware pkg you know
  363. [20:07:19] <AaronF> that's click and go
  364. [20:07:23] <AaronF> installl in 5 min
  365. [20:07:30] <Melvster> oic
  366. [20:07:38] <AaronF> We have thousands using it that way
  367. [20:07:44] <AaronF> from small biz to really big enterprises
  368. [20:07:49] <AaronF> And it's VMware certified
  369. [20:13:02] <openid_pibb> <keturn> jes: see wikispaces.com and wetpaint.com
  370. [20:13:35] * falkor81 (n=brianlan@rrcs-24-106-184-150.se.biz.rr.com) has joined #openid
  371. [20:29:35] * zeeg (n=zeeg@adsl-76-251-95-6.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) has joined #openid
  372. [20:29:40] <zeeg> anyone handled simple registration in python?
  373. [20:30:20] <zeeg> cant find any good documentation on how to handle a request/response for the information
  374. [20:35:39] <_keturn> http://openidenabled.com/files/python-openid/docs/2.0.1/openid.sreg-module.html
  375. [20:40:36] * SignpostMarv (n=Signpost@82-71-31-169.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) has joined #openid
  376. [20:43:41] <zeeg> ya, isnt very useful :p
  377. [20:43:47] <zeeg> ive managed to get it to return the request w/ it
  378. [20:43:53] <zeeg> just cant seem to access the field data
  379. [20:44:34] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) Quit ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  380. [20:46:21] <zeeg> figured it out with a bunch of print x.__dict__ statements
  381. [20:47:49] <_keturn> see also examples/djopenid.consumer.views.finishOpenID
  382. [20:52:27] * falkor81 (n=brianlan@rrcs-24-106-184-150.se.biz.rr.com) Quit ()
  383. [20:52:39] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@cpe-24-27-14-42.austin.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  384. [21:00:02] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #openid
  385. [21:09:41] * Aks (n=chatzill@i-195-137-42-33.freedom2surf.net) has joined #openid
  386. [21:25:43] * freakerz (n=freakerz@modemcable072.181-131-66.mc.videotron.ca) Quit ("Leaving")
  387. [21:27:54] * pvandewyngaerde (n=pvandewy@230.79-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) has joined #openid
  388. [21:33:44] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@rrcs-67-79-196-165.sw.biz.rr.com) has joined #openid
  389. [21:39:11] * marclaporte (n=Marc_Lap@tikiwiki/marclaporte) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  390. [21:43:05] * Mitsurugi ola a tots
  391. [21:43:58] * marclaporte (n=Marc_Lap@tikiwiki/marclaporte) has joined #openid
  392. [21:46:19] <Melvster> i think ive got the recipe for a very simple consumer
  393. [21:46:29] <Melvster> 1. write a page that logs you into a guest account
  394. [21:46:32] <Melvster> 2. add a form
  395. [21:46:43] <Melvster> 3. add openid consumer authentication
  396. [21:46:52] <Melvster> the end
  397. [21:47:49] <Melvster> i think most people will be able to manage that in order to openid enable their sites
  398. [21:48:33] <SignpostMarv> hrm
  399. [21:48:36] <SignpostMarv> guest account ?
  400. [21:48:50] <Melvster> sure, just to get you started
  401. [21:49:04] <Melvster> you can make it multi account after that
  402. [21:49:27] <Melvster> link ids etc.
  403. [21:49:30] <SignpostMarv> i'm confused ,why would you need a guest account
  404. [21:49:45] * tbbrown_ (n=tbbrown@rrcs-67-79-196-165.sw.biz.rr.com) has joined #openid
  405. [21:49:57] <Melvster> just to make the implementation easier
  406. [21:50:05] <Melvster> this could be done in an evening
  407. [21:50:26] <Melvster> a full consumer could take much longer and be beyond most site owners
  408. [21:50:54] <Melvster> it's sort of a waypoint for adding openid to your site
  409. [21:50:55] * digitalspaghetti (n=digitals@86.157.196.126) has joined #openid
  410. [21:50:55] <SignpostMarv> install wordpress. install wpopenid. done :-P
  411. [21:51:33] <Melvster> but what if i have a forum
  412. [21:51:34] * pvandewyngaerde (n=pvandewy@230.79-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  413. [21:51:42] <SignpostMarv> bbPress
  414. [21:51:43] <Melvster> or a blog
  415. [21:51:44] <SignpostMarv> :-P
  416. [21:51:48] <SignpostMarv> wordpress is a blog
  417. [21:51:49] <SignpostMarv> :-P
  418. [21:51:51] <Melvster> hmm blog bad example :)
  419. [21:51:55] <SignpostMarv> lol
  420. [21:52:02] <digitalspaghetti> whats the beef on OpenID and Open Auth?
  421. [21:52:28] <SignpostMarv> Melvster: it's fairly trivial to hook into the wordpress auth system
  422. [21:53:46] <Melvster> but i already have a forum system, i dont really want to change to bbpress
  423. [21:54:00] <Melvster> if i can add the consumer myself
  424. [21:54:38] <Melvster> the janrain consumer example seems pretty straightforward
  425. [21:54:41] <SignpostMarv> Melvster: then you'd look at wordpress integration plugins
  426. [21:54:42] <Melvster> start a consumer
  427. [21:54:44] <_keturn> I guess the part I don't understand is what OpenID buys you in that case
  428. [21:55:17] <Melvster> it allows all member permissions
  429. [21:55:34] <Melvster> basically it puts you one step up from a guest
  430. [21:55:39] <Melvster> but one below a full account
  431. [21:56:28] * markjones (n=markjone@c-76-20-233-71.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  432. [21:56:31] <Melvster> lets say i want to play sudoko
  433. [21:56:51] <Melvster> on sudokular or something
  434. [21:57:17] <Melvster> i might just want to play a few games - i might not need a full account
  435. [21:58:43] <Melvster> you can use your account to access the system, until they get a full account system working
  436. [21:58:57] <SignpostMarv> logging into a site in order to play a game is moronic
  437. [21:59:13] <SignpostMarv> you should only log in to record your high scores :-P
  438. [21:59:20] <Melvster> true
  439. [21:59:30] <Melvster> but look how many people play minesweeper
  440. [21:59:33] * tbbrown (n=tbbrown@rrcs-67-79-196-165.sw.biz.rr.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  441. [21:59:48] <SignpostMarv> on their computer
  442. [21:59:49] <SignpostMarv> for free
  443. [22:00:08] <_keturn> I guess I don't know why you're asking the user to log in at all in that case
  444. [22:00:24] <_keturn> if you're not actually going to associate any data with their login
  445. [22:02:21] <Melvster> because i dont want to give member functions to guests
  446. [22:03:36] <Melvster> but anyone with an openid im prepared to trust
  447. [22:03:44] <SignpostMarv> hah
  448. [22:03:46] <SignpostMarv> you're a fool
  449. [22:03:55] <Melvster> why?
  450. [22:04:13] <SignpostMarv> nothing stopping a spammer or hacker having an OpenID
  451. [22:04:34] <Melvster> of course the really persistent will always get through
  452. [22:04:44] <SignpostMarv> Melvster: http://marvulous.co.uk/
  453. [22:04:45] <SignpostMarv> whoops
  454. [22:04:47] <SignpostMarv> wrong url
  455. [22:04:50] <Melvster> but most folk tend to be honest, at least i hope so! :)
  456. [22:04:52] <SignpostMarv> http://botbouncer.com/
  457. [22:05:17] <Melvster> great app
  458. [22:05:53] * SignpostMarv modified wpopenid to use bot bouncer's API :-P
  459. [22:08:21] <Melvster> i guess i want to have something half working when im half finished, thats how i constructed the recipe
  460. [22:08:52] <Melvster> it will provide the functionality i need, which is for people with an openid to login and make posts / leave comments
  461. [22:09:26] <Melvster> i can work on user mappings after that
  462. [22:15:45] * jeffmcneill (n=jeffmcne@66.162.254.21) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  463. [22:17:26] * peace-keeper (n=peace-ke@81-223-92-227.sechshaus.xdsl-line.inode.at) Quit (Connection timed out)
  464. [22:25:32] * digitalspaghetti (n=digitals@86.157.196.126) Quit ("http://pastemonkey.org")
  465. [22:35:30] * Aks (n=chatzill@i-195-137-42-33.freedom2surf.net) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  466. [22:40:46] <zeeg> recipe to add a consumer: add a field to your user table that is for the openid_key
  467. [22:40:50] <zeeg> problem solved :)
  468. [22:40:55] <zeeg> oh, and make username/password nullable
  469. [22:41:02] <zeeg> at least thats the way we approached it
  470. [22:41:22] <SignpostMarv> nullable ?
  471. [22:45:53] <openid_pibb> <cygnus> nullable as in "able to store a NULL value"
  472. [22:46:25] <openid_pibb> <cygnus> zeeg & others, I recommend an "identifiers" table of (user_id foreign key, openid_identifier varchar(2047))
  473. [22:46:26] <openid_pibb> <cygnus> that way, users can have many identifiers
  474. [22:47:37] * cote (n=cote@mb15f36d0.tmodns.net) has joined #openid
  475. [22:53:11] <zeeg> hrm
  476. [22:56:44] <don-o> im trying to put a YADIS document ref into my home page
  477. [22:57:02] <don-o> anyone have an example of this? what ive got so far is <head> <meta http-equiv="X-XRDS-Location"> </head>
  478. [22:58:00] <don-o> oh i think ive got it. the meta tag needs a content="http://server/yadis.xml"
  479. [22:58:09] <SignpostMarv> why using a meta tag ?
  480. [22:58:16] <don-o> SignpostMarv: whats a better way?
  481. [22:58:28] * SignpostMarv would've thought it'd be a <link> tag
  482. [22:58:38] <don-o> SignpostMarv: oh. the yadis spec says meta tag
  483. [22:58:43] <openid_pibb> <cygnus> no
  484. [22:58:44] <SignpostMarv> odd
  485. [22:58:49] <SignpostMarv> cygnus ?
  486. [22:58:54] <openid_pibb> <cygnus> one either sends the X-XRDS-Location HTTP header or uses an http-equiv META tag.
  487. [22:59:02] <SignpostMarv> ah
  488. [22:59:18] <don-o> cygnus: what are you 'no'ing?
  489. [22:59:26] <SignpostMarv> not like <link rel="XRDS" href="http://server/yadis.xml" /> wouldn't make sense :-P
  490. [22:59:36] <openid_pibb> <cygnus> no to link tags :)
  491. [22:59:42] <don-o> cygnus: oh :)
  492. [22:59:57] <openid_pibb> <cygnus> (Just Say No to Link Tags.)
  493. [22:59:58] <don-o> i dont understand the link and meta tags. there just so... meta!
  494. [23:00:02] <SignpostMarv> but yeah, if it's meant to come in as a header, a <meta> tag would the (shudders) correct way
  495. [23:00:44] <don-o> anyone here have a home page with a yadis document?
  496. [23:00:57] * SignpostMarv thinks that <meta> tags are the second most abused tag, next to <font>
  497. [23:01:39] <don-o> oh and whats with XRDS when the spec is called YADIS?
  498. [23:02:16] <SignpostMarv> data encapsulation foramt ?
  499. [23:02:43] <don-o> yeah, im reading about it in the yadis doc now. its eXtensible Resource Descriptor.
  500. [23:02:47] <don-o> yikes.
  501. [23:03:37] <_keturn> my home page just points to my xrds on myOpenID
  502. [23:03:51] * cote (n=cote@mb15f36d0.tmodns.net) Quit ()
  503. [23:06:03] <don-o> im adding a foaf URL to my yadis/xrds document
  504. [23:09:21] <don-o> neat. livejournal already does this.
  505. [23:10:06] <don-o> oh but only for their openid service, not for Foaf-ness
  506. [23:10:41] * SignpostMarv wonders what FOAF does that XFN doesn't
  507. [23:11:00] * cote (n=cote@mb65f36d0.tmodns.net) has joined #openid
  508. [23:20:00] * cote (n=cote@mb65f36d0.tmodns.net) Quit ()
  509. [23:20:49] <_keturn> XFN sounds like it should be the name of a television station
  510. [23:22:21] <openid_pibb> <cygnus> or an XRI-related technology
  511. [23:22:31] <Mitsurugi> let me ask an offtopic question !!!!
  512. [23:22:32] <openid_pibb> <cygnus> ** cygnus ducks
  513. [23:25:48] * ichigo (n=ichigo@chello062178051055.18.11.vie.surfer.at) Quit (Client Quit)
  514. [23:35:08] * cote (n=cote@mad5f36d0.tmodns.net) has joined #openid

These logs were automatically created by OpenIDlogbot on chat.freenode.net using a modified version of the Java IRC LogBot.