IRC Log for #openid on 2007-10-18

Timestamps are in UTC.

  1. [00:11:56] * marclaporte (n=Marc_Lap@tikiwiki/marclaporte) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  2. [00:16:01] <benbangert> hmmm
  3. [00:16:33] <benbangert> I don't suppose anyone has a recommendation on a user-friendly message to show during the HTML form display that now occurs during POST with OpenID 2.0?
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  5. [00:26:09] <jibot> marclaporte is Marc Laporte from Tiki CMS/Groupware
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  21. [02:24:46] <jibot> marclaporte is Marc Laporte from Tiki CMS/Groupware
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  24. [02:43:33] <jibot> marclaporte is Marc Laporte from Tiki CMS/Groupware
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  27. [02:55:52] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> benbangert - which post are you refering to?
  28. [02:56:36] <benbangert> During OpenID 2.0, the RP may find out that a OP wishes you to POST the credentials
  29. [02:56:53] <benbangert> so the libs docs that I've seen, have it throw up a form with the POST to the OP, using a meta refresh
  30. [02:57:16] <benbangert> so the user only sees it for a second... but they're still left wondering about the screen that just popped up, instead of the immediate redirect OpenID 1.0 has
  31. [03:01:39] * marclaporte (n=Marc_Lap@tikiwiki/marclaporte) has joined #openid
  32. [03:01:39] <jibot> marclaporte is Marc Laporte from Tiki CMS/Groupware
  33. [03:01:41] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> oh i see - presumably the browser will POST the form so fast that the the user will not see it
  34. [03:02:55] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> i would think that most OPs will return a form with some javascript to auto-submit the form to the RP
  35. [03:14:38] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> likewise if the RP is sending the Auth request to the OP, it can just return some html with the form and some Javascript to autosubmit it
  36. [03:18:08] * marclaporte (n=Marc_Lap@tikiwiki/marclaporte) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  37. [03:40:29] <benbangert> yea, that does occur
  38. [03:40:47] <benbangert> however, depending on the speed of the POST to the OP, a user could be staring at it for a good few seconds
  39. [03:41:01] <benbangert> if the OP isn't lightning quick, there's plenty of time to wonder what you're looking at
  40. [03:46:22] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> the RP should return as little as possible to the browser. there should be no images, no css, no external objects. just the form, and JS to submit the form.
  41. [03:47:03] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> oh i see your point, the OP could suck and be slow
  42. [03:47:24] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> well, hopefully, most of your users will have fast OPs
  43. [03:48:18] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> although, now with OpenID 2.0, OPs are supposed to perform realm verification on the RP, so there could be some latency
  44. [03:54:10] <benbangert> hmm, a blank page doesn't sound that good
  45. [03:54:34] <benbangert> the JanRain example consumer shows a page thats almost as mysterious as nothing though, about, "Please wait while OpenID does something or rather"
  46. [03:59:33] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> A "good" OP should display "something" to the user as soon as it receives the auth request
  47. [04:00:17] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> i woudl think that the burden is on the OP to display an interstitial page if it's unable to display anything useful to the user
  48. [04:10:21] <benbangert> well, in this case, its the time it takes the OP to fulfill the POST
  49. [04:10:47] <benbangert> even a fast one like myopenid.com still leaves the user for about a full second on the page thats POSTing
  50. [04:31:17] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> it seems that this is really the OP's problem
  51. [04:31:58] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> one possible solution is for the OP to throw up "something" while it's doing its processing, so the user doens't have to look at a blank screen
  52. [04:33:02] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> alternatively, the RP could display a "please wait..." screen at the top of the HTML, with the form with the auth request at the bottom of the page
  53. [04:38:04] <benbangert> errr, well, its the fault of the browser for not acting fast enough
  54. [04:38:27] <benbangert> somtimes a slow webapp being the OP might not take the POST instantly, until it handles the POST, and sends a reply, the client is left watching whatever is on the screen
  55. [04:38:49] <benbangert> mild latency from other countries could easily cause a decent amount of lag on this as well
  56. [04:39:14] <benbangert> but yea, displaying a please wait... seems like the best bet
  57. [04:40:17] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> an RP that really cares about user experience can show a "please wait HTML" with the auth request form at the bottom. This would probably be optimal
  58. [04:41:29] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> bennagert - out of curiosity - where are you located? is latency an issue for you when you browse to US based websites?
  59. [04:42:31] <benbangert> nah, I'm in California, latency isn't much of an issue
  60. [04:42:43] <benbangert> in my testing, I regularly have time to see the whole page pop-up
  61. [04:42:57] <benbangert> I'll minimize it some more and see if that helps on speed
  62. [04:48:29] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> ok - well in openid 2.0, OPs are supposed to make a direct call back to the RP (this is new in draft 12) which could cause additional latencyu
  63. [04:49:02] <benbangert> ahh, while the POST is occuring?
  64. [05:06:01] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> yes - the OP is supposed to verify the RP's realm by calling back to the RP. This potentially could be cached by smart OPs
  65. [05:07:04] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> see section 13 in the spec http://openid.net/specs/openid-authentication-2_0-12.html#rp_discovery
  66. [05:07:56] <openid_pibb> <Atom Dude> this allows an OP to determine if the realm is bogus or not
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  88. [10:57:30] <jibot> marclaporte is Marc Laporte from Tiki CMS/Groupware
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  120. [15:34:36] <mmealling> anyone seen any blog entries on whether there is any integration between OpenAuth and OpenID?
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  125. [16:03:34] <trel1023> you mean oauth?
  126. [16:03:40] <trel1023> there is no formal integration
  127. [16:03:59] <trel1023> but the spec points out that the two technologies dovetail nicely
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  129. [16:09:53] <mmealling> trel1023, I guess its oauth (the spec that AOL released, right?)
  130. [16:10:17] <trel1023> openauth is aol i think
  131. [16:10:28] <trel1023> oauth is the one announced a couple weeks ago
  132. [16:10:33] <trel1023> oauth.net
  133. [16:12:19] <mmealling> ok.... yea, different specs....
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  157. [19:19:27] <openid_pibb> <=eran> OpenID + OAuth: http://groups.google.com/group/oauth/browse_thread/thread/9af5c0368f8a1162
  158. [19:19:47] <openid_pibb> <=eran> Is there a test service for OpenID RPs?
  159. [19:21:26] <johill> yeah but I forgot where it is :)
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  162. [19:22:44] <johill> oh wait, sorry, no, there's a test for providers that I know
  163. [19:29:13] <openid_pibb> <=eran> yeah, I found that one
  164. [19:29:29] <johill> I've tested my RP against a fewproviders by just signing up and trying it
  165. [19:29:34] <johill> but I don't know of a test suite per se
  166. [19:29:44] <openid_pibb> <=eran> I need to figure out why my RP isn't coming up with the same signature
  167. [19:29:57] <johill> oh heh
  168. [19:30:05] <johill> never had that sort of problem using the janrain libs
  169. [19:30:25] <openid_pibb> <=eran> I'm writing a new C++ OpenID 2.0 lib
  170. [19:30:35] <openid_pibb> <=eran> so its all new code
  171. [19:30:55] <johill> right
  172. [19:31:22] <johill> can't much help you with that in any case, I'm just a (happy) user of the libs and gleefully ignoring most of the details
  173. [19:59:20] <openid_pibb> <=eran> 6 hours later turns out I was double URL encoding the public key...
  174. [19:59:40] <openid_pibb> <=eran> :-(
  175. [20:02:16] <GabeW> that happens
  176. [20:02:17] <GabeW> a lot
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  178. [20:13:58] <openid_pibb> <=eran> We really need a test server that will tell show you what is going on
  179. [20:14:09] <openid_pibb> <=eran> when an RP is connecting etc.
  180. [20:14:51] * illustir (n=alper@c51448e84.cable.wanadoo.nl) has joined #openid
  181. [20:14:51] <openid_pibb> <=eran> but at least now I'm 98% done with a full OpenID 2.0 library in C++
  182. [20:15:13] <openid_pibb> <=eran> just waiting on the final word on XRI Resolution...
  183. [20:15:24] <GabeW> cool
  184. [20:15:55] <GabeW> just FYI, we had a call today and tehre were *no* proposed substantive changes - we're reviewing the last editor's draft now
  185. [20:16:46] <openid_pibb> <=eran> the last one posted has a lot of notes on it and some missing sections
  186. [20:19:59] <GabeW> the things missing are not really substantive
  187. [20:20:05] <GabeW> like "conformance requirements"
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  190. [21:08:56] <openid_pibb> <=eran> openid.org is so BAD!
  191. [21:09:16] <openid_pibb> <=eran> They even do HTTP wrong
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  193. [21:53:17] * benj3one (n=ben@adsl-75-41-185-190.dsl.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net) Quit ("Ex-Chat")
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  195. [21:57:00] * digitalspaghetti (n=digitals@drupal.org/user/88490/view) has joined #openid
  196. [22:08:34] * claudio is now known as claudio\out
  197. [22:12:41] * digitalspaghetti (n=digitals@drupal.org/user/88490/view) Quit ()
  198. [22:18:43] * SvenDowideit_ (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) Quit ("Leaving")
  199. [22:27:03] * marclaporte (n=Marc_Lap@tikiwiki/marclaporte) has joined #openid
  200. [22:27:03] <jibot> marclaporte is Marc Laporte from Tiki CMS/Groupware
  201. [22:31:49] * UncleFu86 (n=Horst@dtmd-4db5c8e4.pool.einsundeins.de) Quit ("Verlassend")
  202. [22:44:21] * marclaport1 (n=Marc_Lap@bas3-montreal02-1096681718.dsl.bell.ca) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  203. [22:48:56] * illustir (n=alper@c51448e84.cable.wanadoo.nl) has joined #openid
  204. [22:54:56] * ArlequinNoir (n=Horst@dtmd-4db5c8e4.pool.einsundeins.de) Quit ("Verlassend")
  205. [23:46:53] * mmealling (n=mmeallin@c-69-180-6-105.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  206. [23:47:20] * cote (n=cote@mb50736d0.tmodns.net) has joined #openid
  207. [23:50:46] * cote (n=cote@mb50736d0.tmodns.net) Quit (Client Quit)
  208. [23:50:58] * cote (n=cote@mb50736d0.tmodns.net) has joined #openid
  209. [23:53:12] * ichigo (n=ichigo@chello062178051055.18.11.vie.surfer.at) Quit ()

These logs were automatically created by OpenIDlogbot on chat.freenode.net using a modified version of the Java IRC LogBot.