IRC Log for #openid on 2008-01-17
Timestamps are in UTC.
- [00:07:37] * shigeta (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) has joined #openid
- [00:08:18] * Prometheus^ (n=Promethe@cs181170022.pp.htv.fi) Quit ()
- [00:08:47] * tourguide (n=tourguid@host32.fordhamips.f.subnet.rcn.com) has joined #openid
- [00:09:29] <tourguide>
i cant login to myopenid - am i doing something wrong
- [00:09:36] <tourguide>
n00b
- [00:10:28] <_keturn>
tourguide: what happens?
- [00:10:39] <tourguide>
it cant find user http://tourguide.openid.org/
- [00:10:51] * tjohns (n=tjohns@cpe-76-170-58-80.socal.res.rr.com) has joined #openid
- [00:10:53] <tourguide>
user name : tourguide.myopenid.com
- [00:10:58] <tourguide>
then I type password
- [00:11:08] <tourguide>
User name or password incorrect
- [00:11:41] <tourguide>
im sure I dont have the password wrong
- [00:13:00] <tourguide>
im doing this ( http://openid.org/ChangePassword.aspx ) now to try again
- [00:13:32] <tourguide>
ok changed it to very simple password
- [00:13:53] <_keturn>
openid.org and myopenid.com are different companies
- [00:14:03] <tourguide>
but same login?
- [00:14:08] <tourguide>
with openid?
- [00:14:43] <tourguide>
i want to try my openid login can u provide a link to test my login
- [00:15:16] <_keturn>
you could try https://pibb.com/
- [00:15:25] <tourguide>
going
- [00:15:49] <_keturn>
or http://openiddirectory.com/
- [00:17:10] <tourguide>
crapo phone call
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- [00:43:39] <tourguide>
Im looking at this screen - https://pibb.com/signin?
- [00:46:28] <tourguide>
http://openiddirectory.com/loginwindow.php
- [00:46:39] <tourguide>
what do i type for my login
- [00:46:45] <tourguide>
http://openiddirectory.com/loginwindow.php
- [00:46:53] <tourguide>
tourguide.openid.org
- [00:48:32] <_keturn>
right
- [00:48:43] <tourguide>
k im going to try it now
- [00:48:47] * MrTopf (n=cs@pD9EBD819.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #openid
- [00:49:21] <tourguide>
Authentication error.
- [00:49:28] <tourguide>
not sure whats up
- [00:49:41] <tourguide>
Er.
- [00:50:18] <tourguide>
pibb asked for a diff ID called myopenid
- [00:53:35] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> tourguide..
- [00:53:46] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> where did you get an openid.org openid from?
- [00:53:48] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> I didn't know they were a provider now..
- [00:54:00] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> oh, I see, different from .net
- [00:54:01] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> how confusing
- [00:54:02] <tourguide>
I got my OpenID from OpenID.org
- [00:54:16] <tourguide>
yah .net didnt offer
- [00:54:34] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> pibb will work with any openid provider that conforms to the standard
- [00:54:58] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> they just suggest myopenid as a provider as it's quite a nice provider, and it's also run by them
- [00:55:00] <tourguide>
link to try pibb - https://pibb.com/signin?
- [00:55:28] <tourguide>
i should just use myopenid then - its tha same standard?
- [00:55:44] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> I'm using pibb right now with the openid 'creativepony.com' which delegates to bluepony.myopenid.com
- [00:55:55] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> no, there is no 'standard provider'
- [00:55:56] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> you use whatever you like
- [00:56:03] <tourguide>
k
- [00:56:08] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> that's the point of openid
- [00:56:50] <tourguide>
Instructions for confirming your account have been send to you at kyle....
- [00:57:41] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> what does pibb say exactly when you enter tourguide.openid.org and attempt login?
- [00:57:54] <tourguide>
ill try it again 1 sec
- [00:58:27] <tourguide>
from here - https://www.myopenid.com/signin_submit it says
- [00:58:34] <tourguide>
User name or password incorrect
- [00:58:39] <tourguide>
but it's correct
- [00:58:46] <tourguide>
i just changed it to test
- [00:58:51] <tourguide>
used a simple password
- [00:59:10] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> now you've registered with myopenid.com?
- [00:59:11] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> i am very confused
- [00:59:12] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> what openid are you using now?
- [00:59:34] <tourguide>
i plan to use tourguide.myopenid.com
- [00:59:50] <tourguide>
i registered with both but wont be using OpenID.org
- [00:59:58] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> oh
- [01:00:11] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> so you have a 'tourguide' user on myopenid now..
- [01:00:20] <tourguide>
yes
- [01:00:32] <tourguide>
will it pull my info from OpenID.org>
- [01:00:37] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> and for the username you are entering 'tourguide' and using 'test' or whatever it was as the password?
- [01:00:50] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> no
- [01:00:51] <tourguide>
correct
- [01:00:52] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> how would myopenid.com know you ever visited openid.org
- [01:01:01] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> only you know that
- [01:01:07] <tourguide>
i it wouldn't
- [01:01:28] <tourguide>
so im rebuilding it now - my account
- [01:01:52] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> so you are logged in to myopenid.com now? O_o
- [01:01:59] <tourguide>
yes :-))))
- [01:02:06] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> I thought it wasn't letting you login...
- [01:02:09] <tourguide>
looking at https://www.myopenid.com/settings
- [01:02:15] <tourguide>
it wasnt
- [01:02:18] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> then what is the problem?
- [01:02:20] <tourguide>
i was trying openid.org
- [01:02:33] <tourguide>
tourguide.openid.org
- [01:02:37] <tourguide>
to login
- [01:03:18] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> alrighty
- [01:03:20] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> OpenID Discovery Failure
- [01:03:26] <tourguide>
yah - whats new
- [01:03:30] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> I'll poke the JanRainer's about it :)
- [01:03:38] <tourguide>
glad im using myopenid.com
- [01:04:06] <PibbRelay>
<keturn> about what?
- [01:05:04] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> pibb seems incompatible with openid.org url's, 'OpenID Discovery Failure' is the error given
- [01:06:39] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> the only thing I'm seeing which is peculear about openid.org accounts is that the url 'tourguide.openid.org' appears to redirect to a different address, and it's the different address which actually contains the openid.server information, rather than serving it from that actual subdomain
- [01:07:03] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> no wait.. confusingly, it redirects, but only to a different address on the same subdomain
- [01:07:14] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> weirdo asp.net site O_o
- [01:07:17] <tourguide>
would it help to have the pass
- [01:07:30] <tourguide>
i change remove it later tonoght
- [01:07:51] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> no, it's fine, the error is before authentication
- [01:07:55] <tourguide>
k
- [01:08:26] <_keturn>
It's probably best if you never give your account password to anyone on IRC. Or anywhere else.
- [01:08:39] * tjohns (n=tjohns@cpe-76-170-58-80.socal.res.rr.com) Quit ()
- [01:08:46] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> entering the address it redirects to, 'http://tourguide.openid.org/user.aspx?username=tourguide', doesn't help either, though instead of getting a friendly error from pibb, I get an Application Error (the 500 error of no specific debug information rails likes to give!)
- [01:08:56] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> if we needed to, we could register our own openid.org account :)
- [01:09:10] <tourguide>
myopenid.com - blurb is too long! Blurbs must be shorter than 1000 characters - why dont i get an alert why im tryping in the box? oh well - also might want to make the Notice Alert in Red
- [01:09:51] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> this isn't the place to make non-openid feedback about a particular service. On pibb, there is a myOpenID channel you can go to for that :)
- [01:10:04] <tourguide>
k, cool sorry thanks
- [01:10:12] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> I'm forwarding it to that channel now :)
- [01:14:16] <PibbRelay>
<keturn> oh, I see what's going on. openid.org issues a Location header that's not an absolute URL.
- [01:14:48] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> ahh, those arseholes
- [01:14:54] <tourguide>
ha
- [01:14:59] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> mind you it's become semi-standard practice these days :(
- [01:16:27] <tourguide>
ok - thanks everyone - Im setup with a OpenID - will spread the word - http://tourguide.myopenid.com/
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- [01:32:54] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> maybe someone should throw a print out of the HTTP standard tied to a brick through their window? :P
- [01:32:55] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> or politely write an email explaining the situation? :)
- [01:32:57] <PibbRelay>
<keturn> poor guys have had enough bricks thrown through their windows from people mad at them for squatting openid.org
- [01:32:58] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> Both are good options!
- [01:32:59] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> Both are good options!
- [01:33:58] <PibbRelay>
<Blueberry> great o..o
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- [06:57:20] <flaccid>
damn it feels good to fix things. still gotta config the new server to get back to dev!
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- [09:11:02] <Makenshi>
I found a wireless captive portal solution that supports openid
- [09:11:23] <Makenshi>
http://coova.org/wordpress/index.php/2007/06/08/openid-wifi/
- [09:28:19] * Acro (i=acro@unaffiliated/acro) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
- [09:33:16] <tjohns>
Makenshi: Looks nice.
- [09:33:45] * shigeta_ (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) Quit ("Leaving...")
- [09:44:57] <danbri>
Mekenshi, that's great :)
- [09:45:06] <danbri>
*Makenshi, sorry
- [09:45:55] <Makenshi>
No worries, I thought it was pretty neat too :)
- [09:46:11] <Makenshi>
I might have a go setting it up on a separate ssid at work
- [09:48:26] * danbri blogging it
- [09:52:19] <Makenshi>
Interestingly, they also have a method to permit one's facebook friends to log in. I wonder, is there any method like foaf that could be used in conjunction with OpenID in that manner?
- [09:52:47] <danbri>
once you know who someone else, something like FOAF should drop in nicely
- [09:52:58] <danbri>
what we were always missing in the foaf community ... ...was yep, openid
- [09:53:26] <danbri>
you should be able to express restrictions on who uses your wireless, like they're in such and such public group
- [09:53:40] <Makenshi>
That would be neat.. specify your openid, and the level of friends you want to permit access (1, 2, 3, ...)
- [09:53:46] <danbri>
and defer ACL maintainance to sites like Facebook (which yes, shoudl expose foaf or equivalent, as an opt-in)
- [09:53:47] <tjohns>
That would be very cool.
- [09:54:33] <Makenshi>
Although is that feasible, because the only way i can think of to verify someone is to enumerate the friends of each and every friend until you find a match
- [09:54:51] <Makenshi>
That would quickly consume a lot of resources
- [09:56:12] <danbri>
should be possible to cache
- [09:56:33] <danbri>
if google can search every word in every public document ever, ... matching people against friend lists ought to be do-able
- [09:56:43] <danbri>
its getting the level of aggregation right that's tricky
- [09:56:53] <danbri>
not per-person, not per-planet, but somewhere in the middle
- [09:57:13] <tjohns>
I don't think it would be that tough...
- [09:57:51] <danbri>
i wonder if the community wireless guys here in Bristol would be interested
- [09:58:16] <danbri>
apart from http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/01/my_open_wireles.html ... lots of folk these days close off their networks (mainly I guess because the boxes default to closed)
- [09:58:34] <Makenshi>
danbri: you're not far from me then, in Birmingham
- [09:58:48] * danbri waves in a north-easterly direction :)
- [09:58:53] <Makenshi>
:o)
- [09:58:56] <danbri>
pleased to meet you
- [09:59:05] <Makenshi>
Likewise *tips hat*
- [09:59:23] <Makenshi>
Wasn't it one of the Bristol guys that got poached by UKERNA?
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- [09:59:57] <Makenshi>
Josh I think
- [10:01:19] <Makenshi>
Kinda makes me want to go write a Thesis, but I am moving to Denmark next month
- [10:09:41] * hillsy (i=shaunh@npfit2.dh.bytemark.co.uk) has joined #openid
- [10:12:20] <danbri>
UKERNA, not sure... I'm a bit out of the university loop
- [10:14:24] <Makenshi>
They changed their name recently to JANET(UK)
- [10:16:59] * danbri scribbles http://danbri.org/words/2008/01/17/254
- [10:19:42] <Makenshi>
random trivia, my father obtained his degree from Bristol University
- [10:20:20] <Makenshi>
and Bristol is the hq of the supplier of our change management system
- [10:20:50] * danbri worked there (standardsy project work) 95-2001 or so
- [10:21:03] <danbri>
what do you work on?
- [10:21:18] <Makenshi>
I am a sysadmin for a he/fe college
- [10:21:46] <Makenshi>
I'm optimistic that I can find a similar position at Aalborg University
- [10:22:15] <Makenshi>
I am going to fosdem this year, wonder if there's anything I could do to promote OpenID
- [10:22:23] <Makenshi>
I am mainly helping out with Amarok
- [10:24:03] <Makenshi>
My blog is mostly about virtualization as that is a lot of what i do at work
- [10:24:16] <Makenshi>
It's about time I started writing about other things
- [10:32:45] <danbri>
nothing wrong with having a niche :)
- [10:52:46] * p33r__ (n=espen@43.80-203-79.nextgentel.com) has joined #openid
- [11:13:42] <Makenshi>
On another topic, I am annoyed with the BBC. Their podcasts continue to list shows which are no longer available. I corresponded with them and they said that they can only keep material for 7 days due to licensing.
- [11:13:58] <Makenshi>
If that is the case, they should remove them from the podcast feeds
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- [12:47:41] <Makenshi>
danbri: it seems your latest post hasn't showed up on the rss feed, yet
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- [13:11:28] <jibot>
evanpro is Evan Prodromou, info at http://wikitravel.org/en/User:Evan
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- [16:06:35] <jibot>
Luke is a student at Purdue University and President of the Linux Users Group as well as a free culture enthusiast.
- [16:07:06] <Luke>
is there a guide for setting up my own openid server somewhere?
- [16:08:02] <Luke>
ah nevermind - i found the wiki
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- [16:39:25] <jibot>
evanpro is Evan Prodromou, info at http://wikitravel.org/en/User:Evan
- [16:56:05] * p33r__ (n=espen@43.80-203-79.nextgentel.com) Quit ()
- [17:03:53] <evanpro>
Ugh
- [17:04:05] <evanpro>
Hey, does anyone want to have a chat about BotBouncer?
- [17:04:21] <evanpro>
It seems to have absolutely zero internationalization support.
- [17:04:30] <evanpro>
It doesn't seem to vary on language at all.
- [17:05:12] <evanpro>
So someone who's a Chinese speaker and logs into my Chinese-language OpenID-supporting Web site won't get past the bot bouncer, unless they can figure out the English on the page.
- [17:05:55] <evanpro>
Not only that, but the pictures are very culturally sensitive.
- [17:07:38] <evanpro>
For example, an array of Ticketron tickets looks like they match "ticket" to most, but to people outside the US, they may not look like tickets at all.
- [17:08:08] <evanpro>
I'm mentioning this because I've been demoing OpenID to friends and colleagues in Montreal...
- [17:08:14] <evanpro>
... French-speakers ...
- [17:08:23] <evanpro>
... and they all balk when the get to a BotBouncer page.
- [17:08:48] <evanpro>
Clearly, if you don't speak English like you live in Portland, the OpenID world has nothing for you.
- [17:08:53] <evanpro>
Fuck off, bot.
- [17:11:22] <evanpro>
Or an array of photos of scissors, which are known as "shears" in the rest of the English-speaking world.
- [17:12:11] <evanpro>
I'd like to contrast with a simple CAPTCHA, which shows a string of characters to type in.
- [17:12:25] <evanpro>
It's clear what you have to do, since everyone has CAPTCHAs.
- [17:13:03] <evanpro>
This might make a better blog post than an IRC chat.
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- [17:41:34] <danbri>
evanpro, i got halfway thru and thought "he should blog this!"
- [17:41:57] <danbri>
so yup, write it up ... with screenshots, and maybe people will find resources out there to help
- [17:42:35] <danbri>
whether its botbouncer or similar sites, definitely worth documenting the issue
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- [18:54:18] <kyevan>
Hi! Has anyone experemented with using OpenID for identifying users on non-web based things?
- [18:55:47] <PibbRelay>
<mpg4> evanpro: you know that botbouncer is a completely optional service, right?
- [18:56:18] <Makenshi>
kyevan: it can be used to authenticate people on wireless networks
- [18:57:18] <PibbRelay>
<mpg4> as in: if you have lots of french- or chinese-speaking users on your site, don't use botbouncer?
- [18:57:26] <PibbRelay>
<mpg4> kyevan: The Oauth project may be what you're looking for
- [18:57:30] <PibbRelay>
<mpg4> http://oauth.net/
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- [19:00:42] <kyevan>
mp4: I dunno, that looks like it's more for apis to services, and such
- [19:01:15] <kyevan>
Background: I've been tinkering with a (non-web-based) virtual world chat thing (like we don't have enough already >_> But this one's mine!)
- [19:02:19] <kyevan>
And being able to log in via OpenID in that sort of thing seems like it /should/ be possible, but I haven't seen anyone playing with that sort of use
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- [19:25:00] <keturn>
kyevan: well, the fact that, as an OpenID RP, you're strongly encouraged to let the user use whatever OpenID provider they want, means that you have to be able to give the user a web browser so they can do whatever login mechanism their provider needs
- [19:26:09] <keturn>
so if popping up a web browser is an option for you application, it's doable. If not, you need a protocol that has some other interface specified.
- [19:37:15] <kyevan>
keturn: Poping up a web browser is, indeed, feasable.
- [19:37:45] <kyevan>
In fact, it's something I'd probably want to do anyway for other things (Help, linking out to whatever, etc))
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- [19:41:33] <keturn>
in that case, you can open the browser with an OpenID request. probably the easiest thing to implement is have a listener on localhost that the browser gets redirected back to when it's done.
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- [19:53:11] <armin390>
how i can login with yahoo openid?
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- [21:31:36] <jibot>
evanpro is Evan Prodromou, info at http://wikitravel.org/en/User:Evan
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