IRC Log for #openid on 2008-02-08

Timestamps are in UTC.

  1. [00:14:06] * kylefox (n=kyle@139.142.50.169) Quit ()
  2. [00:16:01] * sh1mmer (n=croucher@nat/yahoo/x-146b21131fb9b200) has joined #openid
  3. [00:16:11] <sh1mmer> hi
  4. [00:16:28] * forsaken (n=eric@63.172.83.18) has joined #openid
  5. [00:16:45] <sh1mmer> I'm having some signing issues using the dev branch of the janrain php libs
  6. [00:17:10] <sh1mmer> I'm wondering if there is some setup I haven't done I should have
  7. [00:19:30] * SignpostMarv (n=Signpost@82-71-31-169.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) has joined #openid
  8. [00:20:40] <imajes> hey sh1mmer
  9. [00:20:51] <sh1mmer> hello omnipresent
  10. [00:21:01] <sh1mmer> didn't fancy the myspace party?
  11. [00:21:08] <imajes> didn't know about it
  12. [00:21:27] <imajes> where was it advertised
  13. [00:23:31] <sh1mmer> invite only
  14. [00:23:36] <sh1mmer> assumed you had been
  15. [00:23:40] <imajes> ah well i wasn't good enough for an invite
  16. [00:23:44] <sh1mmer> you normally are
  17. [00:23:53] <imajes> i've been quiet
  18. [00:23:57] <imajes> who got invited then
  19. [00:24:03] <sh1mmer> Mike Butcher asked me mean question
  20. [00:24:06] <imajes> (i assume you went?)
  21. [00:24:07] <sh1mmer> not that I'm surprised
  22. [00:24:07] <sh1mmer> heh
  23. [00:24:12] <sh1mmer> I went for an hour
  24. [00:24:15] <sh1mmer> internal hack day today
  25. [00:24:28] <imajes> who was there
  26. [00:24:42] * shigeta (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) has joined #openid
  27. [00:40:03] * Signpost (n=Signpost@82-71-31-169.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) has joined #openid
  28. [00:51:40] * SvenDowideit_ (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) has joined #openid
  29. [00:57:29] * SignpostMarv (n=Signpost@82-71-31-169.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  30. [01:05:30] * SvenDowideit (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) has joined #openid
  31. [01:08:13] * forsaken (n=eric@63.172.83.18) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  32. [01:10:26] * SvenDowideit__ (n=SvenDowi@203-158-44-12.dyn.iinet.net.au) Quit (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable))
  33. [01:23:45] * SvenDowideit_ (n=SvenDowi@twiki/developer/SvenDowideit) Quit (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable))
  34. [01:25:28] * michelp (n=michelp@64.122.195.246) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  35. [01:30:49] * danbri (n=danbri@204.9.178.253) has joined #openid
  36. [01:39:09] * kryptos23 (n=kryptos@freenet/developer/kryptos) has joined #openid
  37. [01:41:01] * danbri (n=danbri@unaffiliated/danbri) Quit ()
  38. [01:49:27] * danbri (n=danbri@204.9.178.253) has joined #openid
  39. [02:05:28] * SignpostMarv (n=Signpost@82-71-31-169.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) has joined #openid
  40. [02:06:47] * danbri (n=danbri@unaffiliated/danbri) Quit ()
  41. [02:09:14] * rebel_leader (n=Horst@X68be.x.pppool.de) has joined #openid
  42. [02:19:24] * brianlmoon (n=brianm@h19.65.18.98.ip.windstream.net) has joined #openid
  43. [02:21:50] * Signpost (n=Signpost@82-71-31-169.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  44. [02:22:00] * rebel_leader (n=Horst@X68be.x.pppool.de) Quit ("Verlassend")
  45. [03:14:50] * sh1mmer (n=croucher@nat/yahoo/x-146b21131fb9b200) Quit ()
  46. [03:21:02] * brianlmoon (n=brianm@h19.65.18.98.ip.windstream.net) Quit ("This computer has gone to sleep")
  47. [03:28:22] * trel1023 (n=trel1023@cpe-071-065-202-118.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #openid
  48. [03:28:22] <jibot> trel1023 is Terrell Russell of http://claimID.com and http://weblog.terrellrussell.com
  49. [03:33:41] * michelp (n=michelp@69-30-72-119.dq1sf.easystreet.com) has joined #openid
  50. [03:34:02] * tjohns (n=tjohns@cpe-76-170-58-80.socal.res.rr.com) has joined #openid
  51. [03:41:57] * michelp (n=michelp@69-30-72-119.dq1sf.easystreet.com) Quit ("Ex-Chat")
  52. [04:21:12] * flaccid_ (n=flaccid@123-243-80-114.tpgi.com.au) has joined #openid
  53. [04:35:40] * flaccid (n=flaccid@123-243-80-114.tpgi.com.au) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  54. [04:43:33] * Digitalxero (n=Digitalx@153.90.88.9) has joined #openid
  55. [04:45:12] <Digitalxero> I was wondering if there was some form of test server for OpenID, so I could test my consuder to figure out why the requests it is sending are considered bad by Yahoo and other OpenID servers I have tested it on
  56. [04:53:14] * Digitalxero (n=Digitalx@153.90.88.9) has left #openid
  57. [05:05:48] * l0gic (n=l0gic@84.91.8.144) Quit (Nick collision from services.)
  58. [05:06:28] * l0gic (n=l0gic@84.91.8.144) has joined #openid
  59. [05:56:33] * shigeta_ (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) has joined #openid
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  64. [07:04:27] * l0gic (n=l0gic@84.91.8.144) Quit (Nick collision from services.)
  65. [07:05:07] * l0gic (n=l0gic@84.91.8.144) has joined #openid
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  69. [07:21:31] * polyonymous (n=hacker@pD953AB11.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) Quit (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable))
  70. [07:23:05] * polyonymous (n=hacker@pD953B133.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #openid
  71. [07:37:40] * SignpostMarv (n=Signpost@82-71-31-169.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  72. [08:21:41] * shigeta (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) has joined #openid
  73. [08:24:35] * shigeta__ (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) has joined #openid
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  75. [08:38:53] * shigeta_ (n=shigeta@124.32.114.226) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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  77. [09:01:30] * flaccid_ (n=flaccid@123-243-80-114.tpgi.com.au) has joined #openid
  78. [09:15:47] * sh1mmer (n=croucher@nat/yahoo/x-2db64fd32fe1887d) has joined #openid
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  82. [10:09:44] * sh1m (n=croucher@nat/yahoo/x-1e2a3cb50ff3e485) has joined #openid
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  84. [10:13:32] * hillsy (i=shaunh@npfit2.dh.bytemark.co.uk) has joined #openid
  85. [10:16:09] * sh1mmer (n=croucher@nat/yahoo/x-2db64fd32fe1887d) Quit (No route to host)
  86. [10:18:19] * a9913 (n=a9913@unaffiliated/a9913) has joined #openid
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  99. [13:41:33] * bortzmeyer (i=bortzmey@batilda.nic.fr) has joined #openid
  100. [13:50:06] * bottiger_ (n=arvid@psi0.nbi.dk) has joined #openid
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  102. [14:32:13] * tux21b (n=christop@trujillo.srv.pocoo.org) has joined #openid
  103. [14:33:42] <tux21b> hi is here somebody with python-openid experiences? the login works, but i cant find a way to suppress the output to stdout
  104. [14:34:18] <tux21b> (and mod_wsgi tends to kill processes when they write to stdout *g*)
  105. [15:54:40] * MrTopf (i=hidden-u@oecher.info) has joined #openid
  106. [15:54:56] * a9913 (n=a9913@unaffiliated/a9913) has joined #openid
  107. [16:01:15] * bottiger_ is now known as bottiger
  108. [16:05:28] * bortzmeyer (i=bortzmey@batilda.nic.fr) has left #openid
  109. [16:06:02] <PibbRelay> <Martin> tux, you can turn that mod_wsgi behavior off
  110. [16:26:22] <keturn> do you mean stdout or stderr?
  111. [16:26:48] <keturn> the default implementation of oidutil.log writes to stderr. you can redefine that if you like.
  112. [16:42:18] * tjohns (n=tjohns@cpe-76-170-58-80.socal.res.rr.com) Quit ()
  113. [17:30:04] * a9913 (n=a9913@unaffiliated/a9913) Quit ("Leaving")
  114. [17:44:50] * michelp (n=michelp@64.122.195.246) has joined #openid
  115. [17:46:27] * forsaken (n=eric@c-71-62-234-185.hsd1.va.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  116. [17:59:46] * idnar (i=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  117. [18:00:08] * idnar (n=mithrand@dsl-243-94-164.telkomadsl.co.za) has joined #openid
  118. [18:20:39] * joevandyk (n=joe@pool-71-188-252-152.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  119. [18:24:19] * salty-horse (n=ori@pdpc/supporter/active/salty-horse) has joined #openid
  120. [18:25:44] <salty-horse> is there work on a best practices guide for openid integration? some implementations think that showing a person's openid url instead of nickname/other name is a good thing :/
  121. [18:46:06] * sh1m (n=croucher@nat/yahoo/x-1e2a3cb50ff3e485) Quit ("Screw you guys, I'm going home")
  122. [19:09:58] * danbri (n=danbri@adsl-75-52-254-197.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) has joined #openid
  123. [19:29:02] <_keturn> http://wiki.openid.net/Relying_Party_Best_Practices , http://www.plaxo.com/api/openid_recipe
  124. [19:39:27] * forsaken (n=eric@c-71-62-234-185.hsd1.va.comcast.net) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  125. [19:39:50] <tux21b> and does anybody know how to suppress the output to stdout? i think its a very poor coding style for libraries to print to stdout directly, where there are enough logging modules around and it makes it simple impossible to use it in a server environment
  126. [19:42:16] <tux21b> and i am talking about the python-openid implementation
  127. [19:43:11] <_keturn> tux21b: um, scroll up three lines?
  128. [19:44:14] <salty-horse> _keturn, thanks. it has exactly what I wanted :)
  129. [19:44:55] <salty-horse> what about *not* revealing a user's openid. is this encouraged/discouraged? meaning, the site uses openid just for user authentication, but beyond that, the user isn't identified in a special way
  130. [19:45:12] <tux21b> _keturn, oh, sry
  131. [19:45:42] <salty-horse> oh, it conflicts with http://wiki.openid.net/Relying_Party_Best_Practices#Don.27t_require_users_to_choose_locally-unique_usernames
  132. [19:46:02] <salty-horse> which I kinda disagree with
  133. [19:48:20] <_keturn> we've defininately had user feedback that they don't want their OpenID identifiers publicly revealed in an RP application. It certainly depends on the type of application. In some cases, having that information be transparent is going to be important to the reputation and credibility of the site members. In other applications, that's not a factor.
  134. [19:51:51] <tux21b> _keturn, thanks for your help. i disabled logging now :)
  135. [19:53:29] * hillsy (i=shaunh@npfit2.dh.bytemark.co.uk) Quit ("Leaving")
  136. [20:00:23] <salty-horse> _keturn, movabletype, for example, doesn't let me choose a nickname to display when commenting -- so I'm identified only by the ugly openid url
  137. [20:10:11] * forsaken (n=eric@c-71-62-234-185.hsd1.va.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  138. [20:27:48] * michelp (n=michelp@64.122.195.246) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  139. [20:40:45] * imajes_ (n=james@87-194-107-123.bethere.co.uk) has joined #openid
  140. [20:41:11] * imajes (n=james@87-194-107-123.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  141. [20:45:29] * imajes_ (n=james@87-194-107-123.bethere.co.uk) Quit ()
  142. [20:53:05] <PibbRelay> <VxJasonxV> I greatly disagree with that one.
  143. [20:53:27] <PibbRelay> <VxJasonxV> I think the OpenID should (*almost* always) be visible, but never visible everywhere/in your face.
  144. [20:54:10] <PibbRelay> <cygnus> a common conclusion is that it ought to be up to the user.
  145. [20:56:58] <salty-horse> PibbRelay, I'm ok with it being up to the user, but sometimes that choice is hidden in the preferences (see livejournal's openid commenting. if you comment without going to preferences first and changing your info, you get the openid as your displayed name)
  146. [20:56:59] <PibbRelay> salty-horse: Error: "I'm" is not a valid command.
  147. [20:57:07] <salty-horse> heh
  148. [20:57:39] <salty-horse> VxJasonxV, that is :)
  149. [20:59:38] <PibbRelay> <cygnus> well, that's a case where the more conservative behavior should be default, i.e., hiding unless explicitly asked to show it.
  150. [21:03:51] <salty-horse> another question: what do you think about services that take your nickname/name from the attribute exchange and use it automatically without letting you modify them? I would assume attribute exchange is best used to auto-fill form fields *before* submission
  151. [21:10:19] * forsaken (n=eric@c-71-62-234-185.hsd1.va.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  152. [21:12:54] * danbri (n=danbri@unaffiliated/danbri) Quit ()
  153. [21:13:00] <PibbRelay> <VxJasonxV> Your IdP should hopefully tell you it'll send the nickname that was requested by the RP
  154. [21:13:11] <PibbRelay> <VxJasonxV> you can remove, modify, or whtever you want at that time
  155. [21:13:38] * danbri (n=danbri@adsl-75-52-254-197.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) has joined #openid
  156. [21:13:55] <PibbRelay> <VxJasonxV> i.e. your IdP has to knowingly send information to the RP requesting it, so HOPEFULLY your IdP asks you to approve it to do so, and if you don't approve it, you can reject the entire transfer, or modify what *does* get sent (if anything)
  157. [21:15:06] * forsaken (n=eric@c-71-62-234-185.hsd1.va.comcast.net) has joined #openid
  158. [21:18:56] * miyagawa (n=miyagawa@monster.bulknews.net) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  159. [21:19:58] * Bushmills (n=l@213-202-176-246.bas504.dsl.esat.net) has joined #openid
  160. [21:20:12] <Bushmills> g'day
  161. [21:23:44] <Bushmills> looking at the "security" archives on openid.net, that issue doesn't seem to be of high relevance.
  162. [21:28:07] <Bushmills> I hoped to find some mention there of the effects of, saying, being victim of a spoofed login page.
  163. [21:28:21] * danbri (n=danbri@unaffiliated/danbri) Quit ()
  164. [21:28:43] <PibbRelay> <VxJasonxV> IdP phishing logins have always been an issue.
  165. [21:29:05] <PibbRelay> <VxJasonxV> Simon Willison's slides have also mentioned the issue, probably in every OpenID presentation of his.
  166. [21:29:37] <Bushmills> that's why I wondered why OpenId seems to be passphrase- rather than, say, PKI based
  167. [21:31:25] * miyagawa (n=miyagawa@monster.bulknews.net) has joined #openid
  168. [21:31:26] <jibot> miyagawa is Tatsuhiko Miyagawa, the author of Plagger <http://plagger.org> and works on Vox <http://www.vox.com> in Six Apart.
  169. [21:31:30] <Bushmills> with a passphrase based system, it appears to me that the problem will only be magnified, because the damage potential is greater (as more participants make their sites accessable to the same id)
  170. [21:35:13] * MrTopf (i=hidden-u@oecher.info) Quit ()
  171. [21:35:25] <_keturn> there's plenty of precedent set for non-passphrase OpenID systems. ssl certs or infocards on myOpenID, hardware tokens at verisign PIP, grid...thingie at Vidoop
  172. [21:35:31] <PibbRelay> <ozamosi> It's not OpenID's problem if you use passphrases or PKI - it's the OpenID Providers problem.
  173. [21:37:00] <Bushmills> ozamosi: good to hear that, I wasn't aware of that.
  174. [21:37:31] <ozamosi> Wow, I'm in here on IRC too? I didn't know :)
  175. [21:37:50] <Bushmills> yes, though the relay
  176. [21:37:59] <Bushmills> through
  177. [21:44:04] <PibbRelay> <VxJasonxV> no, he's here (here being Pibb) and there (there being IRC)
  178. [21:44:16] <PibbRelay> <VxJasonxV> Bushmills: One of the key points of OpenID design is that, to spec, OpenID DOES NOT dictate an authentication method
  179. [21:44:42] <PibbRelay> <VxJasonxV> that's why we have Jabber Message auth, SMS auth, Client Side SSL auth, passwords, cardspace, and even *NO* auth
  180. [21:56:54] * michelp (n=michelp@64.122.195.246) has joined #openid
  181. [22:46:43] * trel1023 (n=trel1023@cpe-071-065-202-118.nc.res.rr.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  182. [23:06:19] * imajes (n=james@87-194-107-123.bethere.co.uk) has joined #openid
  183. [23:30:10] * imajes (n=james@87-194-107-123.bethere.co.uk) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  184. [23:30:42] * trel1023 (n=trel1023@cpe-071-065-202-118.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #openid
  185. [23:30:42] <jibot> trel1023 is Terrell Russell of http://claimID.com and http://weblog.terrellrussell.com
  186. [23:31:53] * imajes (n=james@87-194-107-123.bethere.co.uk) has joined #openid
  187. [23:37:57] * imajes (n=james@87-194-107-123.bethere.co.uk) Quit ()
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  189. [23:51:15] * salty_horse (n=ori@pdpc/supporter/active/salty-horse) has joined #openid
  190. [23:51:43] * salty_horse (n=ori@pdpc/supporter/active/salty-horse) Quit (Client Quit)

These logs were automatically created by OpenIDlogbot on chat.freenode.net using a modified version of the Java IRC LogBot.