IRC Log for #microformats on 2006-01-24

Timestamps are in UTC.

  1. [00:03:31] * _psychic_ (n=john@71.32.228.156) Quit ()
  2. [00:04:11] <mfbot> [[media-info-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=media-info-examples&diff=0&oldid=4373 * Tantek * (+493) reorganized new examples into existing categories and added new sections
  3. [00:05:57] <amanuel_> ryan hehe
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  8. [00:10:41] <jibot> Enric is a media Software Developer and Videoblogger located at http://www.cirne.com
  9. [00:11:02] <mfbot> [[resume-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=resume-examples&diff=0&oldid=4374 * RyanKing * (+879) Tantek Çelik -
  10. [00:11:43] <mfbot> [[resume-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=resume-examples&diff=0&oldid=4375 * RyanKing * (-19) Tantek Çelik - adding overal implied schema analysis
  11. [00:12:34] <mfbot> [[media-info-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=media-info-examples&diff=0&oldid=4376 * Tantek * (-54) edit audio speech example linktext to be more citation like
  12. [00:25:50] <mfbot> [[media-info-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=media-info-examples&diff=0&oldid=4377 * Tantek * (+131) fix video example links' linktext to be more citation-like
  13. [00:26:47] <mfbot> [[resume-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=resume-examples&diff=0&oldid=4378 * RyanKing * (+263) Dan Connolly - added breakdown of Dan's affiliations
  14. [00:29:22] <mfbot> [[media-info-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=media-info-examples&diff=0&oldid=4379 * Tantek * (+125) noted auto-play of rocketboom
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  17. [00:32:49] <mfbot> [[media-info-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=media-info-examples&diff=0&oldid=4380 * Tantek * (+31) fix video example links' linktext to be more citation-like
  18. [00:35:04] * hober (n=ted@unaffiliated/hober) Quit ("nil")
  19. [00:42:45] <mfbot> [[media-info-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=media-info-examples&diff=0&oldid=4381 * Tantek * (+5) fix photo example links' linktext to be more citation-like
  20. [00:49:54] <KevinMarks> http://pezra.barelyenough.org/blog/2006/01/rough-resting-on-rails/
  21. [00:50:23] * therealdam (n=adam@66.196.247.89) Quit ()
  22. [00:59:51] <mfbot> [[resume-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=resume-examples&diff=0&oldid=4382 * RyanKing * (+392) Contact - adding some analysis
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  27. [01:24:48] <mfbot> [[resume-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=resume-examples&diff=0&oldid=4383 * RyanKing * (+119) Publications - more analysis of DanC's resume
  28. [01:27:14] * Enric (n=Enric@adsl-69-226-241-180.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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  34. [01:44:15] <mfbot> [[citation-brainstorming]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=citation-brainstorming&diff=0&oldid=4384 * EranGloben * (-1) Additional Resources -
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  48. [02:07:50] <jibot> Enric is a media Software Developer and Videoblogger located at http://www.cirne.com
  49. [02:16:32] <mfbot> [[distributed-conversation-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=distributed-conversation-examples&diff=0&oldid=4385 * EranGloben * (+1721) added IBIS info and discussion
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  56. [02:54:59] <mfbot> [[media-info-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=media-info-examples&diff=0&oldid=4386 * ScottReynen * (+841) Music -
  57. [03:00:46] * epeus (n=Snak@h-68-164-93-45.snvacaid.dynamic.covad.net) has joined #microformats
  58. [03:03:00] * KevinMarks (n=Snak@pdpc/supporter/active/kevinmarks) Quit (Nick collision from services.)
  59. [03:03:56] * epeus is now known as KevinMarks
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  62. [03:18:25] * ChanServ sets mode +o Tantek
  63. [03:18:35] * Tantek sets mode +o KevinMarks
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  68. [03:34:16] * Enric (n=Enric@adsl-67-119-19-18.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) has joined #microformats
  69. [03:34:16] <jibot> Enric is a media Software Developer and Videoblogger located at http://www.cirne.com
  70. [03:34:39] * Enric (n=Enric@adsl-67-119-19-18.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) Quit (Client Quit)
  71. [04:03:19] * edsu (n=esummers@66.187.134.52) Quit ("leaving")
  72. [04:26:01] <Tantek> one-up-manship as a method for inspiring collaboration among individuals
  73. [04:26:12] <Tantek> oops, wrong room :)
  74. [04:26:13] * gregelin (n=gregelin@216-80-120-72.mart-bsr1.chi-mart.il.cable.rcn.com) Quit ()
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  85. [05:59:05] * kingryan (n=kingryan@dsl081-240-149.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net) has joined #microformats
  86. [05:59:06] <jibot> kingryan is ryan king
  87. [05:59:26] * ChanServ sets mode +o kingryan
  88. [06:00:05] <mfbot> [[resume-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=resume-examples&diff=0&oldid=4387 * RyanKing * (+73) Brian Suda - added "Casey Conroy"
  89. [06:13:26] * zacker (n=zack@h-67-102-71-4.snfccasy.covad.net) has joined #microformats
  90. [06:13:26] <jibot> zacker is working at CivicSpace Labs : www.civicspacelabs.org
  91. [06:15:42] * _limbo_ (i=_limbo_@dsl081-055-160.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net) has joined #microformats
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  93. [06:18:54] <jibot> cgriego is Chris Griego (-06:00).
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  105. [07:16:20] <jibot> blake is allegedly human. Blake, also known as Cortland M. Setlow, studies at swarthmore.edu and enjoys building things, exploring buildings, and physics. He currently sleeps during the day.
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  109. [07:56:27] <jibot> blake is allegedly human. Blake, also known as Cortland M. Setlow, studies at swarthmore.edu and enjoys building things, exploring buildings, and physics. He currently sleeps during the day.
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  117. [10:35:49] <mfbot> [[cite-formats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cite-formats&diff=0&oldid=4388 * MarkRickerby * (-246) Fields Used by Bibtex - fixed table formatting to improve readability
  118. [10:39:50] <mfbot> [[cite-formats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cite-formats&diff=0&oldid=4389 * MarkRickerby * (-351) BibTeX citation Types - more fixes
  119. [10:43:48] * Frederic is now known as neuro`
  120. [10:44:00] * neuro` is now known as frederic
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  122. [11:13:38] <jibot> trovster is a web developer from the UK who writes on http://www.trovster.com and runs www.csslounge.co.uk
  123. [11:14:22] * danja (i=DannyAye@host252-217.pool80104.interbusiness.it) has joined #microformats
  124. [12:42:32] * frederic is now known as Frederic
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  127. [13:24:13] <jibot> dglazkov is Dimitri Glazkov (http://glazkov.com)
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  135. [13:53:37] <jibot> mlinksva is Mike Linksvayer and from Creative Commons
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  144. [15:15:08] <mfbot> [[hreview]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hreview&diff=0&oldid=4390 * B.K. DeLong * (+128) Examples in the wild -
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  148. [15:37:06] <jibot> blake is allegedly human. Blake, also known as Cortland M. Setlow, studies at swarthmore.edu and enjoys building things, exploring buildings, and physics. He currently sleeps during the day.
  149. [15:43:15] * edsu (n=esummers@66.187.134.52) has joined #microformats
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  151. [15:50:01] * bkdelong (n=bkdelong@h-67-102-164-116.cmbrmaor.covad.net) Quit ("Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com")
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  155. [16:10:36] <jibot> RobertBachmann is Robert Bachmann <http://rbach.priv.at/> and lives in Austria (Timezone: +01:00)
  156. [16:14:31] * zacker (n=zack@h-67-102-71-4.snfccasy.covad.net) has joined #microformats
  157. [16:14:31] <jibot> zacker is working at CivicSpace Labs : www.civicspacelabs.org
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  160. [16:21:58] * mlinksva (n=mlinksva@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/mlinksva) has joined #microformats
  161. [16:21:58] <jibot> mlinksva is Mike Linksvayer and from Creative Commons
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  164. [16:42:14] * blake (n=blake@alumnicc1.alumni.unc.edu) has joined #microformats
  165. [16:42:14] <jibot> blake is allegedly human. Blake, also known as Cortland M. Setlow, studies at swarthmore.edu and enjoys building things, exploring buildings, and physics. He currently sleeps during the day.
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  171. [17:10:50] <jibot> Enric is a media Software Developer and Videoblogger located at http://www.cirne.com
  172. [17:29:10] * Atamido (n=atamido@cpe-67-9-173-252.austin.res.rr.com) Quit (Excess Flood)
  173. [17:29:26] * blake (n=blake@alumnicc1.alumni.unc.edu) has joined #microformats
  174. [17:29:26] <jibot> blake is allegedly human. Blake, also known as Cortland M. Setlow, studies at swarthmore.edu and enjoys building things, exploring buildings, and physics. He currently sleeps during the day.
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  178. [17:54:49] <jibot> tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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  185. [18:11:17] <jibot> bkdelong is B.K. DeLong, Head Research Analyst for HALO Worldwide - http://www.haloworldwide.com. Web: http://www.brain-stream.com. Email: bkdelong@pobox.com
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  188. [18:30:05] <jibot> hober is Edward O'Connor and works for EVDB on http://eventful.com/ and lives in San Diego, CA (-08:00)
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  193. [19:09:04] <jibot> trovster is a web developer from the UK who writes on http://www.trovster.com and runs www.csslounge.co.uk
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  196. [19:30:58] <jibot> factoryjoe is Chris Messina, works for Flock, Bar Camp & Rhyzomatic & is working towards open source world domination & factorycityblug (http://factoryjoe.com/blog/) & looks like http://www.flickr.com/photos/dotben/70970770/
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  203. [20:01:19] <jibot> blake is allegedly human. Blake, also known as Cortland M. Setlow, studies at swarthmore.edu and enjoys building things, exploring buildings, and physics. He currently sleeps during the day.
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  209. [20:19:53] <mfbot> [[media-info-examples]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=media-info-examples&diff=0&oldid=4391 * Mary Hodder * (+86) move some misclassified items, correct typos
  210. [20:21:26] <trovv> Heh, Technorati is a showcase of microformats. I just looked at a page from the "directory" MF, viewed the source and see <b>. I think that's ironic.
  211. [20:22:56] <trovv> Also, just looked briefly at rel="home" for both <link> in the <head> and within the page. What other rel="" are for links. As I know Opera can use them, like rel="sitemap" and glossary
  212. [20:23:05] * LTjake (n=brian@h64-5-219-130.gtcust.grouptelecom.net) has left #microformats
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  216. [20:54:54] <mfbot> [[media-info-brainstorming]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=media-info-brainstorming&diff=0&oldid=4392 * Mary Hodder * (+9)
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  222. [21:28:46] <jibot> kingryan is ryan king
  223. [21:28:49] * ChanServ sets mode +o kingryan
  224. [21:30:39] <Frederic> hello kingryan. Do you have some clues about that amazon tagging removed post at techcrunch?
  225. [21:30:50] <kingryan> no idea
  226. [21:31:07] <kingryan> haven't seen that post
  227. [21:31:23] <Frederic> well, was just on bloglines
  228. [21:32:00] <Frederic> And I still have it
  229. [21:33:21] <limbo_> you means amazon still has tags?
  230. [21:36:03] <Frederic> Well, according to techcrunch post, they don't
  231. [21:36:19] <Frederic> But they have removed the post and I can only see it in bloglines
  232. [21:36:29] <limbo_> oh
  233. [21:36:43] * danja (i=DannyAye@host252-217.pool80104.interbusiness.it) Quit ("Ciao!")
  234. [21:36:53] <limbo_> that's strange
  235. [21:37:51] <Frederic> it is but it's true
  236. [21:47:47] * Enric (n=chatzill@c-67-188-10-66.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #microformats
  237. [21:47:47] <jibot> Enric is a media Software Developer and Videoblogger located at http://www.cirne.com
  238. [21:48:52] <mfbot> [[to-do]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=to-do&diff=0&oldid=4393 * RyanKing * (+149) Ryan -
  239. [21:49:35] <kingryan> hey limbo_, we have a 'via' link relationship now --> http://www.iana.org/assignments/link-relations
  240. [21:50:31] <Frederic> cool
  241. [21:50:37] <Frederic> _that_ is great
  242. [21:50:41] <limbo_> ooh nice
  243. [21:50:57] <limbo_> although i'd say that cite is a better candidate
  244. [21:51:09] <limbo_> since it already has the conotation of citation
  245. [21:51:17] <limbo_> which links dont necessarily do
  246. [21:53:07] * KevinMarks (n=Snak@adsl-69-109-167-110.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) has joined #microformats
  247. [21:55:51] <kingryan> but via links are *links8
  248. [21:55:58] <kingryan> *links**
  249. [21:56:50] <factoryjoe> kingryan: looks like we might use vote-rel for rating our extensions
  250. [21:56:59] <kingryan> vote-rel?
  251. [21:57:02] <kingryan> what's that?
  252. [21:57:08] <factoryjoe> shuddup
  253. [21:57:13] <factoryjoe> rel="vote-for" et al
  254. [21:57:14] <kingryan> you mean vote-links?
  255. [21:57:17] <factoryjoe> or rev?
  256. [21:57:20] <kingryan> rev="vote-for"
  257. [21:57:21] <factoryjoe> yeah, sorry
  258. [21:57:31] <factoryjoe> what's rev mean?
  259. [21:57:37] <kingryan> reverse relationship
  260. [21:57:54] <factoryjoe> whoa
  261. [21:57:54] <factoryjoe> ok
  262. [21:57:57] <factoryjoe> right
  263. [21:58:07] <kingryan> why 'whoa'?
  264. [21:58:28] <limbo_> put me down for vote-against ;)
  265. [21:59:02] <kingryan> I'm still vote-abstain
  266. [21:59:17] <factoryjoe> b/c reverse relationship sounds complex
  267. [21:59:22] <factoryjoe> but yeah, i get it
  268. [21:59:24] <limbo_> it's the first day of schoo. can you blame me for being negative?
  269. [21:59:24] <limbo_> *school even
  270. [21:59:41] <factoryjoe> oh, i thought that was your normal level of snark
  271. [21:59:57] <limbo_> this is going a bit beyond the call
  272. [22:00:13] <kingryan> usually he restrains snark towards friends' projects
  273. [22:00:26] <limbo_> i try.
  274. [22:00:30] <factoryjoe> oh
  275. [22:00:34] <factoryjoe> you don't though
  276. [22:00:36] <factoryjoe> :P
  277. [22:00:41] <limbo_> hehe
  278. [22:00:47] <kingryan> wha?
  279. [22:00:58] <limbo_> btw, he meant snark in public. not in private. that's always ok.
  280. [22:01:07] <kingryan> limbo_++
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  290. [22:54:09] <edsu> tantek?
  291. [22:54:12] * Tantek (n=Tantek@70.103.248.130) has joined #microformats
  292. [22:54:39] <edsu> wow, that was like magic or something :)
  293. [22:55:10] <edsu> tantek: i'm ed from the recent citations discussion on microformats-discuss
  294. [22:56:10] <edsu> tantek: thanks for your email
  295. [22:58:15] <Tantek> hi ed. no problem. i'm looking forward to progress towards a cite microformat.
  296. [22:58:54] <Tantek> i'm hoping we can convince the folks with strong opinions on citations to join the irc channel so we can have a dialog
  297. [23:02:30] * briansuda (n=brian@h-68-166-252-239.chcgilgm.covad.net) has joined #microformats
  298. [23:02:31] <jibot> briansuda is brian suda and brian suda of X2V fame
  299. [23:02:49] * therealdam (n=adam@66.196.247.89) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  300. [23:03:00] <edsu> Tantek: me too, that's a good idea
  301. [23:03:46] <Tantek> hi brian!
  302. [23:04:37] * therealdam (n=adam@66.196.247.89) has joined #microformats
  303. [23:04:49] <briansuda> hello
  304. [23:04:56] * dchud (n=dchud@64-252-70-83.adsl.snet.net) has joined #microformats
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  306. [23:08:01] <dchud> last time i popped in here to ask about citations i was handed a parking ticket :)
  307. [23:11:26] <edsu> tantek: not to be a bastage, but i'm wondering where ical was found on the internet in human visible form
  308. [23:12:39] <edsu> you are totally right openurl is not human readable, but the key/value pairs are used to summarize citations every day in web applications
  309. [23:13:41] <edsu> from your email i guess you see the utility of at least looking at the property names
  310. [23:14:21] <edsu> i'm just concerned that trying to find a rosetta stone that connects extant citation formats will be recipe for failure
  311. [23:15:16] * edsu quiets down....
  312. [23:15:38] <Tantek> edsu, your analysis is correct
  313. [23:15:42] <Tantek> in reverse order
  314. [23:16:03] <Tantek> yes, trying to find a rosetta stone to connect numerous different formats is a futile endeavour
  315. [23:16:14] <Tantek> the reality is that most attempts at formats are pathetic and can be ignored
  316. [23:16:15] <edsu> whew :)
  317. [23:16:27] <Tantek> ... except perhaps as lessons to be learned
  318. [23:16:33] <edsu> Tantek: jesus, are you serious?
  319. [23:16:48] <edsu> sorry, continue :)
  320. [23:16:57] <Tantek> microformats absolutely recognize the utility of re-using names from existing formats
  321. [23:17:12] <edsu> especially the puny useless ones?
  322. [23:17:39] <edsu> ok now i'll really shut up, that just rattles my chain a bit to here you diss existing formats like that
  323. [23:18:22] <Tantek> seriously, perhaps 1% of formats/standards are in actual use in the real world to any significant degree. the vast majority of previous formats/standards are "shelf-sitters"
  324. [23:18:38] <Tantek> anyway, back to naming
  325. [23:18:54] <Tantek> in particular, more details on naming in the context of microformats here: http://microformats.org/wiki/naming-principles
  326. [23:19:01] <edsu> Tantek: i'm not sure whether to call your bluff on that or not
  327. [23:19:12] <Tantek> in short: microformats try really hard to NOT invent new names for properties/concepts
  328. [23:19:21] <edsu> gotcha
  329. [23:19:46] <Tantek> and yes, the vocabulary of keys in OpenURL is perhaps the most interesting part of it
  330. [23:20:02] <edsu> Tantek: i totally agree with that
  331. [23:20:22] <Tantek> in the case of both iCalendar (RFC2445) and vCard (RFC2426), they completely dominated their respective content spaces (events and contact information)
  332. [23:20:36] <Tantek> nothing even came close in terms of implementation, amount of content etc.
  333. [23:20:48] <Tantek> that is rarely the case when it comes to data formats
  334. [23:20:53] <dchud> okay. that's true also for OpenURL linking.
  335. [23:21:13] <edsu> yeah, i think if you knew the citation space in libraries you would say the same thing about openurl though
  336. [23:21:15] <dchud> not *publishing* citations per se, but the linking piece.
  337. [23:21:17] <hober> speaking of citation, check out http://thatscrazyhot.com/
  338. [23:21:30] <Tantek> dchud, if that is the case, then find some actual examples on the web and add them to the cite-examples page
  339. [23:21:32] * gregelin (n=gregelin@216-80-120-72.mart-bsr1.chi-mart.il.cable.rcn.com) has joined #microformats
  340. [23:21:37] <Tantek> currently there are zero such examples
  341. [23:21:59] <dchud> right, this is where we're not understanding each other
  342. [23:22:11] <edsu> Tantek: that's because as you say -- they are invisible
  343. [23:22:11] <dchud> were there vcard and ical examples *on* the web when you started?
  344. [23:22:18] <Tantek> and yes, microformats is focused on the publishing of human *visible* information
  345. [23:22:29] <Tantek> dchud, yes
  346. [23:22:38] <edsu> hober: thanks!
  347. [23:22:41] <Tantek> more than that though
  348. [23:23:00] <Tantek> vcard and ical literally dominate all the spaces (beyond the web) in terms of contacts and events
  349. [23:23:19] <Tantek> every desktop/laptop today comes with builtin apps that support them
  350. [23:23:26] <dchud> see, now, you get to say that, but we don't get to say that about linking :)
  351. [23:23:56] <dchud> every major commercial citation management product on the market right now supports OpenURL.
  352. [23:24:13] <pbinkley> every academic library user has a link resolver, too
  353. [23:24:15] <Tantek> right, but the problem is that that sounds vaguely like a vertical market statement
  354. [23:24:21] * kingryan looks for a "commercial citation managment product" on his laptop
  355. [23:24:30] <Tantek> yeah, the link resolver bit really sounds bad
  356. [23:24:34] <dchud> kingryan: right. maybe you don't have one, but millions do.
  357. [23:24:46] <pbinkley> bad?
  358. [23:24:47] * hober always used bibtex for citation management
  359. [23:24:58] <Tantek> dchud, kingryan is a grad student, if he doesn't have one, that's not a good sign
  360. [23:25:10] <dchud> Tantek: he's one grad student :)
  361. [23:25:16] <Tantek> anyway
  362. [23:25:17] <dchud> a very technically proficient one, to boot
  363. [23:25:20] <hober> heh: http://www.citationmanagement.com/index.html
  364. [23:25:22] <kingryan> openurl is certainly interesting prior art, but its not the only bit
  365. [23:25:25] <Tantek> the space of citations has NUMEROUS standards
  366. [23:25:25] <hober> not quite what we're talking about
  367. [23:25:31] <edsu> kingryan: as apart of your studies do you get journal articles from licensed databases?
  368. [23:25:33] <dchud> we're not claiming it's the only prior art
  369. [23:25:34] <Tantek> that are in various degrees of use in various places
  370. [23:25:43] <kingryan> edsu, yes
  371. [23:25:45] <Tantek> heck, i'm still waiting for the dublin core police to show up
  372. [23:25:50] * dsalo (n=dsalo@ip68-100-18-183.dc.dc.cox.net) has joined #microformats
  373. [23:25:57] <edsu> kingryan: so you are probably using openurl without knowing it
  374. [23:26:07] <edsu> kingryan: just as many use ical without knowing it
  375. [23:26:29] <Tantek> anywa, the non-human readable aspect makes openurl a showstopper for a microformat
  376. [23:26:30] <dchud> another important point: we don't even imagine we could just convince you that openurl profiles are the answer
  377. [23:26:41] <kingryan> well, most of the time, I use google scholar, but sure, I'm sure I've used it without knowing
  378. [23:26:53] <dchud> how do you think google scholar is linking to libraries for fulltext?
  379. [23:26:56] <edsu> Tantek: the keyvalue pairs is where my interest lies, not in the url aspect anyhow
  380. [23:26:59] <Tantek> dchud, there is no evidence that we need all of openurl to represent "typical" citation publication behavior on the web
  381. [23:27:07] <Tantek> edsu, right
  382. [23:27:16] <Tantek> the key is figuring out WHICH keys to use
  383. [23:27:30] <Tantek> and that's where the research into actual realworld examples comes in
  384. [23:27:31] <kingryan> dchud, I use it to find the free PDFs
  385. [23:27:33] <dchud> Tantek: i'm not claiming you do need all of openurl
  386. [23:27:35] <edsu> Tantek: the point is, that if the microformat leveraged those keyvalue pairs it could be easily used in other contexts
  387. [23:27:36] <Tantek> or rather, that's why we start with that
  388. [23:27:43] <Tantek> edsu, got it
  389. [23:28:13] <Tantek> the steps are roughly
  390. [23:28:25] <Tantek> document plenty of real world web publishing examples
  391. [23:28:31] <Tantek> analyze them for implied schemas therein
  392. [23:29:02] <Tantek> document existing formats
  393. [23:29:19] <Tantek> come up with the 80/20 of common aspects of the examples
  394. [23:29:24] <edsu> eg. bibtex, openurl etc?
  395. [23:29:26] <Tantek> brainstorm on what that 80/20 should be
  396. [23:29:28] <Tantek> edsu, yes
  397. [23:29:33] <Tantek> then
  398. [23:29:46] <Tantek> argue about which names to reuse from which pre-existing works for that 80/20
  399. [23:29:57] <Tantek> perhaps consider several brainstorming proposals
  400. [23:30:13] <Tantek> and what we've found is that it's usually become quite obvious by the end of that discussion what to do
  401. [23:30:18] <Tantek> and there is a fairly good consensus
  402. [23:30:37] <Tantek> anyway, i have to run for a bit
  403. [23:30:45] <Tantek> for now
  404. [23:31:02] <Tantek> i encourage folks to review the cite-examples, cite-formats, and cite-brainstorming pages on the wiki
  405. [23:31:08] <edsu> me too, thanks for the chat
  406. [23:31:31] <Tantek> no problem edsu, thanks for your contributions!
  407. [23:31:49] * dsalo (n=dsalo@ip68-100-18-183.dc.dc.cox.net) has left #microformats
  408. [23:31:51] * Tantek (n=Tantek@70.103.248.130) Quit ("via the nearest exit")
  409. [23:31:55] <kingryan> yes, thanks to you guys for contributing
  410. [23:32:04] <kingryan> but understand where we're coming from...
  411. [23:32:05] <dchud> so just to clarify
  412. [23:32:20] <kingryan> we're thinking web centric (open web, not behind firewalls and such)
  413. [23:32:23] <dchud> where is the best place to put our "microfauxmat" citation markup examples?
  414. [23:32:35] <briansuda> my suggestion for some openURL folks would be to add the key/values to the cite-formats matrix, that would save me some time
  415. [23:32:39] <kingryan> a strawman format?
  416. [23:33:14] <kingryan> probably http://microformats.org/wiki/citation-brainstorming (though I don't know what's there now)
  417. [23:33:24] <dchud> briansuda: okay, the two best profiles to start from are journal and book, should we split them up?
  418. [23:33:37] <kingryan> eh, nevermind on citation-brainstorming, that stuff needs to be moved elsewhere
  419. [23:34:03] <edsu> yeah, that page always confuses me
  420. [23:34:06] <briansuda> go ahead and split them-up, we can always collapse them easier than explode them
  421. [23:34:26] <kingryan> yeah, that's a different discussion
  422. [23:34:38] <dchud> kingryan: yes, that page is fairly different
  423. [23:34:39] <kingryan> its talking about how to do distributed conversation on blogs
  424. [23:34:48] * kingryan created that page :D
  425. [23:34:53] <edsu> heh
  426. [23:35:20] <dchud> kingryan: if you want to move/rename/whatever and post to the list with the specific place you end up wanting us to post these examples, we will
  427. [23:35:36] <kingryan> k, give me some time to move the stuff around, then I'll ping you guys, so that you can put your stuff in
  428. [23:35:41] <kingryan> kk
  429. [23:35:45] * pbinkley (n=pbinkley@its004pb1.library.ualberta.ca) Quit ("Leaving")
  430. [23:35:46] <kingryan> that'll work best
  431. [23:35:48] <dchud> that way we can respond on-list sounding helpful rather than petulantly combative
  432. [23:35:56] <mfbot> [[Talk:citation-brainstorming]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Talk:citation-brainstorming&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+27) Talk:citation-brainstorming moved to Talk:distributed-conversation-brainstorming
  433. [23:35:57] <mfbot> [[citation-brainstorming]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=citation-brainstorming&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+11596) citation-brainstorming moved to distributed-conversation-brainstorming
  434. [23:36:20] <dchud> kingryan: great, thanks for talking us through it
  435. [23:36:35] * Snowden (n=some@c-67-171-198-120.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #microformats
  436. [23:37:00] * dchud (n=dchud@64-252-70-83.adsl.snet.net) has left #microformats
  437. [23:37:37] <kingryan> briansuda, is it ok if I move the cite-* stuff to citation-* ?
  438. [23:37:52] <briansuda> yes please, we do have a naming issue...
  439. [23:37:55] <limbo_> cite has too many senses
  440. [23:38:08] <briansuda> make sure that doesn't collide with your relCite
  441. [23:38:16] <kingryan> I moved limbo_ and I's citeRel stuff to distributed-converstation-*
  442. [23:38:32] <kingryan> and I'm going to move all citation related stuffs from cite-* to citation-*
  443. [23:38:46] <kingryan> just so that we don't confuse 'citation' with '<cite>'
  444. [23:38:50] <briansuda> yes
  445. [23:38:58] <mfbot> [[cite-formats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cite-formats&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+27603) cite-formats moved to citation-formats
  446. [23:38:59] <edsu> cool, thanks guys
  447. [23:39:09] <mfbot> [[cite]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cite&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+4565) cite moved to citation
  448. [23:39:21] <edsu> i have to head out, would be good to continue this conversation though -- without my petulance :)
  449. [23:39:52] <edsu> you guys are doing great work, imho
  450. [23:40:18] * edsu (n=esummers@66.187.134.52) Quit ("leaving")
  451. [23:40:25] <mfbot> [[Special:Log/delete]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Special:Log/delete&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+0) deleted "citation-brainstorming": content was: '#REDIRECT [[distributed-conversation-brainstorming]]'
  452. [23:40:31] <mfbot> [[cite-brainstorming]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cite-brainstorming&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+8844) cite-brainstorming moved to citation-brainstorming
  453. [23:40:47] <mfbot> [[cite-examples]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=cite-examples&diff=0&oldid=0 * RyanKing * (+18389) cite-examples moved to citation-examples
  454. [23:41:00] <kingryan> k, I think I've moved everything
  455. [23:41:27] <briansuda> i'll try to go through it tonight and make sure all the links on the pages link to the right places
  456. [23:43:49] * briansuda (n=brian@h-68-166-252-239.chcgilgm.covad.net) has left #microformats
  457. [23:44:28] <kingryan> thanks briansuda
  458. [23:45:32] * kingryan is now known as kingryan|away
  459. [23:55:55] * karlUshi (n=karl@tea06.w3.mag.keio.ac.jp) has joined #microformats
  460. [23:55:55] <jibot> karlUshi is karlcow

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