IRC Log for #microformats on 2006-06-22
Timestamps are in UTC.
- [00:04:07] * kingryan (n=kingryan@dsl092-180-250.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net) Quit ()
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- [00:07:24] <jibot>
briansuda is brian suda of http://suda.co.uk/ and http://claimid.com/briansuda in his freetime he works on the X2V microformats parser (-0600 CST)
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- [00:49:32] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
- [00:49:53] <KevinMarks>
hi T
- [00:49:58] <KevinMarks>
how'd it go today?
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- [02:29:40] <jibot>
cgriego is Chris Griego (-06:00)
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- [02:35:15] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
- [02:35:42] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
- [02:40:07] * briansuda just pushed Tests and X2V to Hg, be sure to pull and update
- [02:41:26] <jibot>
Hwin is horseygurl, trying to go undercover.
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- [04:59:09] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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- [05:06:20] <jibot>
PhilipAshlock is in Bellingham WA and can be found online at http://www.philaestheta.com/
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- [05:27:28] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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- [06:32:19] <jibot>
Charl is Charl van Niekerk and writes about standards at http://standards.za.net/
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- [07:49:59] <mfbot>
[[zen-garden]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=zen-garden&diff=0&oldid=6787 * Phae * (+637) Open questions -
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- [07:52:21] <jibot>
trovster is a web developer from the UK who writes on http://www.trovster.com and runs www.csslounge.co.uk
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- [08:45:14] <jibot>
ryanlowe is Ryan Lowe, http://www.fanconcert.com
- [08:51:47] <mfbot>
[[Main Page-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Main_Page-fr&diff=0&oldid=6788 * ChristopheDucamp * (+39) Spécifications - add -fr
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- [08:57:48] <mfbot>
[[Main Page-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Main_Page-fr&diff=0&oldid=6789 * ChristopheDucamp * (+1310) Discussions Exploratoires - synchro with Main_Page
- [08:58:49] <mfbot>
[[Main Page-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Main_Page-fr&diff=0&oldid=6790 * ChristopheDucamp * (-1) Discussions Exploratoires - typo
- [09:00:10] <mfbot>
[[Main Page-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Main_Page-fr&diff=0&oldid=6791 * ChristopheDucamp * (+9) Discussions Exploratoires -
- [09:07:12] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-fr&diff=0&oldid=6792 * ChristopheDucamp * (+15) Références "Informative" - add -fr
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- [09:21:03] <mfbot>
[[hreview-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/hreview-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+44305) ''Ceci est une traduction en cours de [[hreview]] seul lien de référence''
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- [09:21:32] <jibot>
gsnedders is a 14 year old idiot from Scotland and pretends to have a website at http://geoffers.uni.cc/
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- [09:25:09] <mfbot>
[[to-do-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=to-do-fr&diff=0&oldid=6793 * ChristopheDucamp * (+43) Traductions - add hreview-fr to be translated
- [09:26:15] <mfbot>
[[to-do-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=to-do-fr&diff=0&oldid=6794 * ChristopheDucamp * (+28) Traductions -
- [09:26:56] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-feedback-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-tag-feedback-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+1230) rel-tag-feedback translation
- [09:28:37] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-fr&diff=0&oldid=6795 * ChristopheDucamp * (+6) Références "Informative" -
- [09:29:03] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-fr&diff=0&oldid=6796 * ChristopheDucamp * (+6) Discussions - add -fr
- [09:33:19] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-faq-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-tag-faq-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+5963) rel-tag-faq à relire
- [09:34:11] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-faq-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-faq-fr&diff=0&oldid=6797 * ChristopheDucamp * (+1) les questions fréqumment posées sur rel-tag -
- [09:35:02] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-fr&diff=0&oldid=6798 * ChristopheDucamp * (+3) Q&R - rel-faq-fr
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- [09:35:58] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-fr&diff=0&oldid=6799 * ChristopheDucamp * (+9) problématiques
- [09:37:09] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-issues-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/rel-tag-issues-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+7849) french translation of rel-tag-issues
- [09:39:20] <mfbot>
[[hreview-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hreview-fr&diff=0&oldid=6800 * ChristopheDucamp * (+28) Schéma -
- [09:40:56] <mfbot>
[[hreview-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hreview-fr&diff=0&oldid=6801 * ChristopheDucamp * (+5) Détails des Champs -
- [09:41:52] <mfbot>
[[hreview-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hreview-fr&diff=0&oldid=6802 * ChristopheDucamp * (+9) Changes from v0.2 -
- [09:43:53] <mfbot>
[[review-formats-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/review-formats-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+3510) translation of review-formats
- [09:44:59] <mfbot>
[[microformat-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/microformat-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+29) #REDIRECT [[microformats-fr]]
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- [09:48:00] <mfbot>
[[to-do-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=to-do-fr&diff=0&oldid=6803 * ChristopheDucamp * (+74) Traductions - updating
- [09:52:01] <mfbot>
[[to-do-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=to-do-fr&diff=0&oldid=6804 * ChristopheDucamp * (+388) Traductions -
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- [12:32:58] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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- [13:11:03] <mfbot>
[[Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+2581) Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles
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- [13:12:19] <mfbot>
[[Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles-fr&diff=0&oldid=6805 * ChristopheDucamp * (-2)
- [13:13:10] <mfbot>
[[hreview-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hreview-fr&diff=0&oldid=6806 * ChristopheDucamp * (+3) Principes De Design XHTML Sémantique - {{semantic-xhtml-design-principles-fr}}
- [13:16:27] <mfbot>
[[xoxo-fr]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/xoxo-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+17198)
- [13:17:03] <mfbot>
[[Christophe Ducamp]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/Christophe_Ducamp * ChristopheDucamp * (+31)
- [13:17:24] <mfbot>
[[Christophe Ducamp]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Christophe_Ducamp&diff=0&oldid=6807 * ChristopheDucamp * (-1)
- [13:17:35] <mfbot>
[[Christophe Ducamp]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Christophe_Ducamp&diff=0&oldid=6808 * ChristopheDucamp * (+5)
- [13:20:06] <mfbot>
[[XOXO-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=XOXO-fr&diff=0&oldid=6809 * ChristopheDucamp * (-17136) DeletedPage voir [[xoxo-fr]]
- [13:21:32] <mfbot>
[[to-do-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=to-do-fr&diff=0&oldid=6810 * ChristopheDucamp * (+114) Traductions - add [[Template:semantic-xhtml-design-principles-fr]]
- [13:24:18] <mfbot>
[[Template:MicroFormatCopyrightStatement2004-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Template:MicroFormatCopyrightStatement2004-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+103) Template:MicroFormatCopyrightStatement2004
- [13:24:44] <mfbot>
[[Template:MicroFormatCopyrightStatement2004-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Template:MicroFormatCopyrightStatement2004-fr&diff=0&oldid=6811 * ChristopheDucamp * (+0) typo
- [13:29:55] <mfbot>
[[Template:MicroFormatCopyrightStatement-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Template:MicroFormatCopyrightStatement-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+601) translation of Template:MicroFormatCopyrightStatement
- [13:30:36] <mfbot>
[[rel-tag-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=rel-tag-fr&diff=0&oldid=6812 * ChristopheDucamp * (+3) Copyright - {{MicroFormatCopyrightStatement2004-fr}}
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- [13:34:02] <mfbot>
[[Template:MicroFormatPatentStatement-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/Template:MicroFormatPatentStatement-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+284) french translation of Template:MicroFormatPatentStatement
- [13:37:39] <mfbot>
[[xoxo-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=xoxo-fr&diff=0&oldid=6813 * ChristopheDucamp * (-15) typo
- [13:46:25] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar-fr&diff=0&oldid=6814 * ChristopheDucamp * (-148) minor editions
- [13:59:03] <DanC>
bummer... the yahoo local stuff isn't XHTML
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- [14:00:22] <jibot>
pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
- [14:02:54] <DanC>
ugh... and tidy gives up on it
- [14:04:48] <DanC>
xsltproc groks, with --html. go DV!
- [14:05:26] <DanC>
hmm... no lat/long in the resulting vcard...
- [14:09:46] <DanC>
x2v doesn't find any calendar stuff in an event listing...
- [14:10:16] <mfbot>
[[press]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=press&diff=0&oldid=6815 * MT * (+158)
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- [14:14:53] <jibot>
briansuda is brian suda of http://suda.co.uk/ and http://claimid.com/briansuda in his freetime he works on the X2V microformats parser (-0600 CST)
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- [14:19:07] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-faq-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/hcalendar-faq-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+9373) hcalendar-faq : french translation to be achieved
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- [14:28:03] <jibot>
dglazkov is Dimitri Glazkov (http://glazkov.com) and lives in Birmingham, AL, USA (-6:00 GMT)
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- [14:38:14] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-faq-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar-faq-fr&diff=0&oldid=6816 * ChristopheDucamp * (+638) Q&R - translation hCalendar-faq to be reviewed
- [14:40:15] <mfbot>
[[to-do-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=to-do-fr&diff=0&oldid=6817 * ChristopheDucamp * (+40) Traductions -
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- [14:42:25] <tantek>
DanC, it is pretty clear that people are using the "Tails" Firefox extension to "test" their microformats
- [14:42:36] <tantek>
I believe that extension is open source
- [14:43:00] <tantek>
it might be a very good idea to work on it a bit to run it through the test suite, and document (or even *fix*) problems with it
- [14:43:29] <tantek>
e.g. I believe it uses the "title" attribute on <span> if present, which is not defined to be valid per hcard-parsing
- [14:43:43] * briansuda agrees, Tails hasn't been updated in a long time
- [14:44:36] <mfbot>
[[icalendar-implementations-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/icalendar-implementations-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+869) icalendar-implementations
- [14:49:35] <DanC>
hmm
- [14:50:07] <mfbot>
[[Main Page]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=Main_Page&diff=0&oldid=6818 * Tantek * (+21) added user-interface
- [14:52:27] * DanC can't figure out how to edit just the implementation section of http://microformats.org/wiki/hcard
- [14:53:37] <DanC>
it's never clear to me whether the [edit] link applies to the section above or below
- [14:54:58] <KevinMarks>
below
- [14:56:19] <mfbot>
[[user-interface]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/user-interface * Tantek * (+826) first draft, collecting recent examples
- [14:56:40] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=6819 * DanC * (+43) update Tails link
- [14:57:27] <DanC>
hmm... "not available for Linux". And I don't see source.
- [14:57:50] * KevinMarks (n=Snak@pdpc/supporter/active/kevinmarks) Quit ("The computer fell asleep")
- [14:58:04] <DanC>
"Tuesday, April 04, 2006
- [14:58:04] <DanC>
Tails Export version 0.3.x "
- [14:58:13] <DanC>
that looks fairly recent to me, briansuda
- [14:58:56] * briansuda stands corrected
- [14:59:10] <DanC>
hmm... maybe that's just thoughts on 0.3, not a release
- [14:59:16] <mfbot>
[[user-interface]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=user-interface&diff=0&oldid=6820 * Tantek * (+109)
- [14:59:31] <DanC>
but this guy Robert de Bruin is clearly still thinking about it
- [14:59:42] * DanC sitll doesn't see source code
- [15:00:17] <briansuda>
if it is just a greasemonkey script shouldn't is just be in your scripts folder for firefox?
- [15:00:50] <DanC>
Tails is a greasemonkey script? doesn't look like it to me.
- [15:01:04] <DanC>
I'm looking at https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/2240/
- [15:01:04] <Zeo>
DanC: https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/2240/ is Tails Export not Tails
- [15:01:14] <DanC>
oops
- [15:01:51] <DanC>
wierd... at http://blog.codeeg.com/tails-firefox-extension/ I saw "The Tails extension hosted on this site is no longer in active development. You can get an extended version of the plugin here."
- [15:02:10] <Zeo>
Different author
- [15:02:36] <DanC>
yes, but the original author says the new author's stuff is "an extended version"
- [15:02:41] * DanC is late for a meeting. sigh.
- [15:03:29] * DanC hunts for a revert button
- [15:05:47] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=6821 * DanC * (+38) revert Tails link, but note extended version
- [15:06:06] <DanC>
tantek, I can't find the source
- [15:08:03] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-examples-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/hcalendar-examples-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+25203) hcalendar-examples : french draft translation
- [15:08:24] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-examples-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar-examples-fr&diff=0&oldid=6822 * ChristopheDucamp * (-1) exemples de hCalendar -
- [15:08:50] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-examples-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar-examples-fr&diff=0&oldid=6823 * ChristopheDucamp * (+2)
- [15:09:00] <tantek>
DanC, the [edit] link depends on whether you have inserted any headings *manually* (with explicity <h1> etc. markup)
- [15:09:30] * pnhBusy can't wait to have some more free time in which to explore all this UI stuff
- [15:09:47] <tantek>
me too Chris
- [15:10:17] <tantek>
But I figure at least I can help document where all this UI stuff is so that when I do have some time, I can easily go through them.
- [15:10:27] <pnhBusy>
aye
- [15:10:59] * DanC is quite concerned about feedback loops... users learn from code/tools, so we gotta keep the code in sync
- [15:12:51] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-tests-fr]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/hcalendar-tests-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+798)
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- [15:18:04] <Zeo>
I can't access http://www.trinityanne.com/tools/extract/
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- [15:26:33] <mfbot>
[[irc-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/irc-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+3435) currently searching my time zone : 17:26 currently in France...
- [15:28:41] <xtof>
??def xtof is Christophe Ducamp you could find me on http://www.communitywiki.org/odd/Xtof/HomePage
- [15:34:14] <mfbot>
[[press-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=press-fr&diff=0&oldid=6824 * ChristopheDucamp * (+158) 2006 - add Mercurtytide
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- [15:34:17] <jibot>
pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
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- [15:39:30] <mfbot>
[[books-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/books-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+1367) translation of books
- [15:51:21] <mfbot>
[[user-interface-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/user-interface-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+1060) user-interface
- [15:53:38] <tantek>
xtof, amazing progress you are making with the French translations
- [15:53:47] <tantek>
user-iterface was just created minutes ago!
- [15:53:52] <tantek>
user-interface even
- [15:54:08] <tantek>
?def xtof
- [15:54:08] <jibot>
Nobody has defined xtof yet
- [15:54:17] <tantek>
?def xtof is Christophe Ducamp you could find me on http://www.communitywiki.org/odd/Xtof/HomePage
- [15:54:17] <jibot>
xtof is Christophe Ducamp you could find me on http://www.communitywiki.org/odd/Xtof/HomePage
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- [15:57:30] <jibot>
pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
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- [16:16:08] <jibot>
cgriego is Chris Griego (-06:00)
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- [16:17:10] <jibot>
kingryan is ryan king
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- [17:09:20] <mfbot>
[[zen-garden]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=zen-garden&diff=0&oldid=6825 * RobertBachmann * (+166) Open questions - Project name
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- [17:09:52] <jibot>
RobertBachmann is Robert Bachmann <http://rbach.priv.at/> and lives in Austria (Timezone: UTC 02)
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- [17:31:34] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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- [18:44:34] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=6826 * Mike Swimm * (+93) New Examples -
- [18:47:27] * gsnedders wants a "colour" property in CSS3
- [18:48:50] <kingryan>
little too late for that
- [18:50:53] <gsnedders>
I know…
- [18:51:10] <dglazkov>
http://interllectual.com/coffee/microformats-at-the-university
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- [19:01:30] <mfbot>
[[faq]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=faq&diff=0&oldid=6827 * Tantek * (+432) added FAQ re: discuss list
- [19:02:17] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar&diff=0&oldid=6828 * Tim * (+83) Examples in the wild -
- [19:03:38] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=6829 * Tim * (+86) Examples in the wild -
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- [19:20:39] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=6830 * DrewMcLellan * (+103) Implementations -
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- [19:38:41] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=6831 * 2098123098120398 * (+96) Examples in the wild -
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- [20:02:09] <RobertBachmann>
wow what a stupid username "2098123098120398"!
- [20:04:32] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-brainstorming-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/hcalendar-brainstorming-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+37140) translation hcalendar-brainstorming / currently beginning the discovery
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- [20:07:17] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
- [20:07:44] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
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- [21:03:01] <jibot>
pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
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- [21:05:55] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=6832 * Rumble * (+112)
- [21:10:11] <tantek>
wow, just noticed that user 2098123098120398 actually made a legit edit to the wiki:
- [21:10:15] <tantek>
http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&curid=1002&diff=6832&oldid=6831&rcid=8552
- [21:10:28] <tantek>
the first all numerical username to do so (all others have been spammers)
- [21:10:41] * tantek wonders who would choose a number that long as their username.
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- [21:22:41] * briansuda things spammers are lulling tantek into a false sense of security
- [21:23:04] <tantek>
it's also longer than any of the spam number user logins
- [21:23:30] <briansuda>
i was looking to see if it might be a phone number or SSN or something, but it is too many digits to make much sense to me
- [21:24:06] <pnhChris>
maybe someone was just really frustrated with trying their normal (non-wikiword) username :P
- [21:25:07] <briansuda>
you still have to remember your username!
- [21:25:39] <tantek>
perhaps they are relying upon the login cookie
- [21:26:04] <briansuda>
or finding a page they already editted to fetch their username
- [21:30:28] <mfbot>
[[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=6833 * Jay Goldman * (+132) Examples in the wild -
- [21:31:03] <tantek>
lots of hCard examples in the wild being added today by new people.
- [21:33:49] <ryanlowe>
it's almost a repeating sequence
- [21:34:12] <ryanlowe>
2 098 123 098 123 098
- [21:34:21] <ryanlowe>
except the last 3 and 0 are inverted
- [21:34:54] <kingryan>
maybe they were just pounding on the keyboard- frustrated by the WikiNameRequirement
- [21:35:32] <cgriego>
WikiNameRequirementSucks
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- [21:38:59] <jibot>
PhilipAshlock is in Bellingham WA and can be found online at http://www.philaestheta.com/
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- [22:30:05] <mfbot>
[[zen-garden-fr]] MN http://microformats.org/wiki/zen-garden-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+6186)
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- [22:36:46] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-example1-steps-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/hcalendar-example1-steps-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+2893) hcalendar-example1 : translation in progess
- [22:37:17] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-example1-steps-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar-example1-steps-fr&diff=0&oldid=6834 * ChristopheDucamp * (-2) hCalendar : Démaches Exemple 1 -
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- [22:49:13] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-example1-steps-fr]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar-example1-steps-fr&diff=0&oldid=6835 * ChristopheDucamp * (+197) draft translation of : hcalendar-example1-steps
- [22:50:24] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-fr]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar-fr&diff=0&oldid=6836 * ChristopheDucamp * (+5) Browsing -
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- [23:15:46] <mfbot>
[[user-interface]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=user-interface&diff=0&oldid=6837 * Membranophonist * (+70) Browser Integration -
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- [23:22:43] * molly (n=molly@ip68-0-175-195.tc.ph.cox.net) has joined #microformats
- [23:25:10] <molly>
hi all, molly here - looking around for the kindness of someone who might have a few minutes to look over an article for me before it publishes. Topic compares Semantic Web and Microformats and introduces Microformats to the broat IT community
- [23:25:25] <molly>
*broad
- [23:26:21] <dantekgeek>
sure
- [23:29:47] <mfbot>
[[hcalendar-issues-fr]] N http://microformats.org/wiki/hcalendar-issues-fr * ChristopheDucamp * (+17277) draft translation : hcalendar-issues
- [23:30:09] <molly>
gonna toss it up on a URL, thx
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- [23:31:22] <jibot>
briansuda is brian suda of http://suda.co.uk/ and http://claimid.com/briansuda in his freetime he works on the X2V microformats parser (-0600 CST)
- [23:32:54] <molly>
hey brian
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- [23:37:54] <kingryan>
hi molly
- [23:39:58] <molly>
hey Ryan
- [23:40:11] * bear is now known as bear_afk
- [23:40:28] <molly>
Okay, here's that article, forgive the formatting, it's going to a publisher in Word, but here it is open for anyone's comments . . . I'd appreciate your thoughts http://www.molly.com/597/
- [23:41:40] <molly>
this isn't for general distribution btw, just for feedback before it publishes
- [23:41:46] * briansuda is reading now
- [23:41:52] <molly>
I thought I'd ask for some help from the community, thanks so much
- [23:42:01] * briansuda is reading (the article) now
- [23:42:31] * kingryan is reading
- [23:46:15] * tantek (n=tantek@66-7-230-34.cust.telepacific.net) has joined #microformats
- [23:46:16] <jibot>
tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
- [23:46:44] * KevinMarks is reading adn listenign to sifry talk at supernova
- [23:46:48] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
- [23:46:56] <molly>
Sifry's talking?
- [23:46:58] <molly>
awesome
- [23:47:10] <tantek>
molly, see #supernova
- [23:47:17] <molly>
hey thanks Tantek!
- [23:47:30] <tantek>
hey Molly :)
- [23:47:35] <molly>
:)
- [23:47:43] <KevinMarks>
molly, do you want proofing or fact-checking?
- [23:47:45] <kingryan>
tantek, we're reading http://www.molly.com/597/ for molly
- [23:47:52] <KevinMarks>
and hi, btw
- [23:48:05] <molly>
facts only
- [23:48:21] <molly>
the markup / formatting is totally the concern of the publisher right now
- [23:48:32] <molly>
I just want facts, and any suggestions for clarifications, that sort of thing
- [23:48:42] <molly>
thank you very very very much
- [23:48:48] <kingryan>
one thing...
- [23:48:53] <kingryan>
this: "The term “semantic” in this case refers to meaning that is data-centric."
- [23:49:07] <kingryan>
could easily be tied to the "computers first" philosophy of the SW
- [23:49:20] <molly>
that note has been bugging me ryan
- [23:49:28] <kingryan>
you kinda hint on that connection, but its not quite there
- [23:49:28] <molly>
that's it, it's unclear how it relates
- [23:49:31] <molly>
yeah
- [23:49:40] <molly>
that's exactly right, thanks
- [23:50:06] <kingryan>
a difference between SW and sw is that SW semantics are machine only, while sw combines machine and human semantics
- [23:50:40] <molly>
it's a subtle difference, isn't it, when trying to explain it to a broader audience?
- [23:50:55] <molly>
the questions I get are well, what's the difference, really, and why does it matter?
- [23:51:05] <kingryan>
its subtle to anyone who doesn't have a CS degree, I think
- [23:51:29] * xtof (n=christop@ATuileries-152-1-13-20.w82-123.abo.wanadoo.fr) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
- [23:51:47] <kingryan>
(maybe not *everyone*, but its is a rather theoretical CS thing)
- [23:51:50] <molly>
I think that was what I was reaching for
- [23:51:53] <molly>
and didn't quite get
- [23:51:56] * rohit__ (n=rohit@64-60-251-193.cust.telepacific.net) has joined #microformats
- [23:52:07] <molly>
what is human, what is machine and what that difference is
- [23:52:10] <molly>
and why it's important
- [23:52:12] * dantekgeek (n=dan_luri@209.213.206.38) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
- [23:52:13] <molly>
if that makes sense
- [23:52:13] <KevinMarks>
FOAF is not that common in blogs either...
- [23:52:17] * briansuda still reading, but have a few points
- [23:52:36] <molly>
Hi Rohit!
- [23:52:39] <tantek>
whoa threads
- [23:52:46] <rohit__>
Hi! we missed you in Scotland!!!
- [23:52:51] <molly>
I missed you too
- [23:53:08] <rohit__>
Rest assured we drank for ya!.... esp since I'm gonna be in your backyard soon, Jersey girl :)
- [23:53:16] <molly>
but I have gotten rave reviews about Brian and Ryan here :)
- [23:53:26] <molly>
which backyard, New Jersey or Arizona?
- [23:53:31] <rohit__>
rave indeed :)
- [23:53:40] <rohit__>
NJ -- moving to manhattan in the fall (!)
- [23:53:44] <molly>
NO way, wow
- [23:53:49] <KevinMarks>
your markup quotes have gone smart on you, molly
- [23:53:57] <molly>
Don't look at that page
- [23:54:00] <molly>
it is temporary and false
- [23:54:06] <molly>
i just need text input
- [23:54:06] <rohit__>
following the wife's career...
- [23:54:11] <molly>
hey good for you Rohit
- [23:54:18] <molly>
New Jersey is actually a great place
- [23:54:24] <tantek>
I don't know about that first note Molly
- [23:54:25] <rohit__>
Isn't that a prince song -- "I want your text!"
- [23:54:27] <briansuda>
in the first paragraph you mention " the W3C approach has been challenged by the concept of Microformats, which achieve the same goal, " Microformats are not trying to "boil the ocean" and solve every problem. RDF in many ways is. In obscure things like Genomix Databases, we can't compete - we don't want too
- [23:54:29] <tantek>
same criticisims as Ryan
- [23:54:32] <molly>
Yeah Tantek
- [23:54:35] <molly>
I don't like it either
- [23:54:38] <molly>
I'm gonna pull it
- [23:54:48] * evanpro (n=evanpro@pdpc/supporter/silver/evanpro) has joined #microformats
- [23:54:53] <kingryan>
talking about "semantics" is tough
- [23:55:02] <molly>
Brian, I think that's a good point but I raise it too late
- [23:55:06] <kingryan>
there's no way around that
- [23:55:18] <molly>
The intro to this piece has to be stronger is what I think it boils down to
- [23:55:25] <tantek>
Molly, who is the audience for this?
- [23:55:30] <molly>
General IT guys
- [23:55:38] <molly>
people doing sysadmin, dabbling in web
- [23:55:42] <molly>
looking for better solutions
- [23:55:45] <tantek>
One of the big problems with all the alphabet soup is that most people, even most tech people can't be bothered with that many acronyms etc.
- [23:55:47] <rohit__>
IT gals?
- [23:55:54] <rohit__>
ok, snooping on the url
- [23:55:54] <molly>
but not necessarily into standards, etc.
- [23:56:04] <tantek>
They're fine with just (X)HTML+CSS+RSS+HTTP etc.
- [23:56:09] <kingryan>
"Web girl for the IT guy" ?
- [23:56:21] <molly>
Actually, some readers are just finding out about XHTML and CSS
- [23:56:30] <molly>
this is my challenge, always has been
- [23:56:35] <tantek>
Molly, that's my point
- [23:56:35] <molly>
the masses are interested, how to explain?
- [23:56:36] <rohit__>
"are considered by many to be" is considered by many to be passive and, in certain cases, convoluted :)
- [23:56:45] <tantek>
discussing RDF, OWL, etc. for that crowd is a totally snoozer
- [23:57:08] <molly>
I'm not sure that's true
- [23:57:17] <molly>
trust my instincts on audience Tantek
- [23:57:19] <molly>
I'm okay on that side
- [23:57:25] <molly>
I just need tech advice
- [23:57:39] <tantek>
I would skip all the SW alphabet soup. Go back to Tim's original highlevel description of Semantic Web as he wrote in his book.
- [23:57:51] <molly>
well, I tried to get the most recent
- [23:57:56] <rohit__>
"encouraging the Web" -> W3Cspeek filter -> "leading the Web [to its full potential]"
- [23:57:56] <molly>
which isn't what's in his book
- [23:58:11] <tantek>
that's my point
- [23:58:16] <tantek>
the stuff in the book is a much better intro
- [23:58:28] <molly>
ok
- [23:58:41] <molly>
i have it here
- [23:58:47] <molly>
not sure I can do a massive change on this
- [23:58:51] <tantek>
I'm not certain it is even worth wasting people's time with the big complex examples.
- [23:58:54] <molly>
but I have the opportunity to smooth it out
- [23:59:01] <molly>
and more in a series to clarify
- [23:59:03] <KevinMarks>
molly, mentioning rel-tag is probably worth it, as it has very high adoption
- [23:59:09] <KevinMarks>
and people are used to the idea of tagging now
- [23:59:14] <tantek>
If I were reading this as a tech person not familiar with the subject matter, that would be sufficient for me to abandon the article
- [23:59:17] <molly>
good point Kevin
- [23:59:32] <tantek>
I would never even get to the "good stuff"
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