IRC Log for #microformats on 2006-07-10

Timestamps are in UTC.

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  12. [01:20:03] <sreynen> does anyone know if there is an Atom or RSS feed of the IRC log transcripts?
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  14. [01:22:05] * ChanServ sets mode +o briansuda
  15. [01:22:05] <jibot> briansuda is brian suda of http://suda.co.uk/ and http://claimid.com/briansuda in his freetime he works on the X2V microformats parser (-0600 CST)
  16. [01:23:11] <sreynen> hi brian
  17. [01:23:39] <briansuda> hello
  18. [01:23:47] <sreynen> i was just reading your email. i generally agree with everything you wrote, but i'm not sure IRC meetups would do much to solve the problems
  19. [01:24:06] <sreynen> i suspect it will always be the same people who can't make it due to time zones and/or scheduling
  20. [01:24:11] <briansuda> feel free to respond and/or also make a suggestion
  21. [01:24:25] <sreynen> so i was thinking about how to make it easier for such people to keep track of the IRC discussions
  22. [01:24:35] <briansuda> well, atleast we try to let everyone kind of decide on a time, and/or each side can hold their own meetup
  23. [01:24:55] <sreynen> do you know if there's an Atom or RSS feed of the IRC log transcripts?
  24. [01:25:20] <briansuda> keeping track would be good, but i think there is something to be said for participating real-time
  25. [01:25:47] <briansuda> this is the only log of this IRC chat i know of, http://rbach.priv.at/Microformats-IRC/
  26. [01:26:12] <sreynen> yeah, every time there's discussion of IRC meetups, and look to see if I'm free at the decided time, but I never am
  27. [01:26:27] <briansuda> true, but atleast you knew about it.
  28. [01:26:45] <briansuda> it isn't a perfect system
  29. [01:27:01] <briansuda> but IMHO, it is better than waiting around in IRC for something to develop
  30. [01:27:02] <sreynen> I think if I regularly read the logs, I'd have more incentive to make time because I'd have a better idea of what sorts of discussions I'm missing
  31. [01:27:37] <briansuda> but there might be even more discussions EVERYONE is missing because the right people weren't around to talk
  32. [01:28:38] <sreynen> yeah, i'm not sure that's a solve-able problem. many of the right people will never use IRC
  33. [01:30:06] <briansuda> agreed, it isn't perfect, but i was floating it out there as another tool in our arsenal, if no one plans on participating, then we can kill that thread, but better to ask than to just kill it straight away.
  34. [01:30:27] <sreynen> yeah
  35. [01:31:12] <sreynen> another thought i had on improving IRC participation was moving it up higher on the discussion page, above the limited-interest mailing lists
  36. [01:31:57] <sreynen> http://microformats.org/discuss , i mean
  37. [01:32:10] <briansuda> yeah, we should also have a page for all the different clients for different OSes, so newbies can get started with IRC.
  38. [01:33:16] <briansuda> can you reply to my email and suggest that? i don't have access to edit the website. If we want more "organic" meetups and "office hours" we should tout the IRC channel abit more
  39. [01:34:45] <briansuda> There are 43 members (reminds me of 43 things, 43 people, 43 places) in this channel, if anyone is around can you say hello?
  40. [01:34:58] <sreynen> i will. i'm hoping to make a quick feed of the logs first, and post both of my thoughts at once
  41. [01:35:14] <briansuda> sreyned, sounds good
  42. [01:35:27] * briansuda can't spell
  43. [01:44:23] <ajturner> hello :)
  44. [01:44:49] <briansuda> hello ajturner
  45. [01:45:07] <ajturner> saw your call for people to say 'hi', wasn't sure who you meant by "members"
  46. [01:45:14] <ajturner> if you just meant 'people in the channel'
  47. [01:45:36] <briansuda> oh, my IRC client says "43 Members", but yes, 43 people in the channel
  48. [01:45:53] <ajturner> colloquy doesn't specify number, the list just scrolls ;)
  49. [01:46:05] <briansuda> my version has the number
  50. [01:46:22] <briansuda> 2.0 (2D16)
  51. [01:46:34] <ajturner> I've been interested in Microformats, and put together some applications both consuming and producing MF, and have been trying to figure out how the entire set of standards "progresses"
  52. [01:46:45] <ajturner> (hrm, I have 2D16 as well)
  53. [01:47:11] <briansuda> i have 2-3 different rooms connected, maybe it has something to do with that?
  54. [01:47:20] <ajturner> I have 10
  55. [01:47:24] <ajturner> where does it say it?
  56. [01:47:29] <briansuda> you should list your applications on the implementations pages
  57. [01:47:33] <ajturner> I have
  58. [01:47:47] <ajturner> http://microformats.org/wiki/adr#Implementations
  59. [01:47:54] <ajturner> GreaseRoute & GreaseRoute embedded
  60. [01:47:56] <ajturner> are 2
  61. [01:48:12] <briansuda> i see how many are in the room listed right below the room name
  62. [01:49:02] <ajturner> and I have an application that pulls together and emails/sms/web shows directions and so attended the Directions BoF at Where2.0
  63. [01:49:08] <briansuda> excellent little scripts, you should look at the GEO microformat too, most maps probably will take either an Address and/or lat/lon
  64. [01:49:33] <ajturner> GreaseRoute is also listed in the GEO, since it consumes those
  65. [01:49:34] <ajturner> ;)
  66. [01:50:11] <briansuda> how are you doing the SMS, just via email?
  67. [01:50:22] <ajturner> API
  68. [01:50:56] <briansuda> API for whom? i ask because i am interested in extending X2V to do things like "Send this event to my phone"
  69. [01:51:03] <ajturner> (looking)
  70. [01:51:47] <ajturner> vazu - https://www.vazu.com/
  71. [01:52:10] <ajturner> I just saw another one the other day that will "call" a phone number and text->speech
  72. [01:52:26] <ajturner> so you can have your phone ring and say "Your appointment starts in 20 minutes" ;)
  73. [01:53:08] <briansuda> interesting! it is north amercia only....
  74. [01:53:16] <briansuda> i will certainly look more into this.
  75. [01:53:23] <ajturner> yeah - and has some small problems, limits on size, etc.
  76. [01:53:55] <briansuda> i think that is an SMS problem
  77. [01:54:09] <ajturner> the application routes you to your appointments automatically, depending on where you are to where the event is, and so the SMS says "You should leave in 10 mins to get to the concert on time. Here are the directions...."
  78. [01:54:13] <ajturner> mayhaps
  79. [01:54:52] <ajturner> hrm, would be nice to have an SMS parse the event MF and add it to your mobile's calendar
  80. [01:55:09] <briansuda> yeah, certainly think there are many possibilities, if/when GPS phones are popular you might be able to do fancy things like "i'm lost how do i get to XYZ event"
  81. [01:55:29] <briansuda> well, with SMS you can have attachements, although i THINK it is specific to the model or the network
  82. [01:55:31] <ajturner> sure- well, right now I just figure you're either at your calendar's set location, or at your last appt
  83. [01:55:55] <briansuda> also, there is some rumblings about PICO formats which are modeled after things like the Dodgeball syntax
  84. [01:56:09] <briansuda> http://microformats.org/wiki/picoformats
  85. [01:56:23] <ajturner> could have the SMS d/l something - I have a snippet of Python code that will watch for an SMS, and when one is rec'd, d/l the url - so that could d/l larger set of directions and display in a browser or something
  86. [01:57:07] <ajturner> neat - haven't heard of PF before
  87. [01:57:16] <briansuda> true, but now you are starting to limit the possible handsets because the implementation requires python
  88. [01:57:31] <ajturner> well, python as a demonstration prototype
  89. [01:57:33] <ajturner> but yes, limited
  90. [01:57:40] <ajturner> so, using PF as an example - what happens to now progress that?
  91. [01:57:45] <briansuda> PFs surfaced on the list several months ago, i'm not sure much has happened yet
  92. [01:58:04] <briansuda> well, to move it forward we'd need to do a few things...
  93. [01:58:16] <briansuda> http://microformats.org/wiki/process
  94. [01:58:35] <briansuda> 1) document current behaviour
  95. [01:59:04] <briansuda> 2) find a specific problem to solve
  96. [01:59:22] <briansuda> (pico formats might not be the best example for these, because it is not built on XHTML)
  97. [01:59:45] <briansuda> 3) find any existing standards to model from (eg vCard, iCalendar, etc)
  98. [02:09:06] <ajturner> hrm -
  99. [02:09:23] <ajturner> so pf - go find out what dodgeball, flagr, et al are using
  100. [02:12:36] <briansuda> yes, but also what they are gathering as input,
  101. [02:12:53] <briansuda> again, picoformats are abit weird because they are trying to define the data and the encoding
  102. [02:13:09] <briansuda> one microformat i have done alot of work with personally, is citations
  103. [02:13:31] <briansuda> in the case of citations we needed to go out and gather examples on the web, how people were citing things, etc.
  104. [02:13:58] <briansuda> then look to see what pre-established formats existed - no sense re-inventing the wheel
  105. [02:15:27] <ajturner> true, but then you look at the "directions" mf, and you see that there a many, all very complex, use cases
  106. [02:15:32] <ajturner> and how do you progress
  107. [02:16:11] <briansuda> you'd have to pick a specific problem and solve that, microformats are not meant to be a generic solution
  108. [02:16:59] <briansuda> citations suffered from alot of the same issues, and things need to be broken down to smaller atomic units
  109. [02:17:20] <briansuda> we spun out ADR and GEO from hCard because they are smaller more atomic and can be used in other formats
  110. [02:17:34] <ajturner> right - they seem fairly straight-forward
  111. [02:17:37] <ajturner> at least by comparison :)
  112. [02:17:42] <briansuda> maybe directions is trying to accomplish too much? and smaller bites should be taken
  113. [02:18:18] <ajturner> just a list of adrs :)
  114. [02:18:32] <briansuda> the other thing is, besides map sites, so many people publish directions? businesses do anyone else?
  115. [02:18:47] <briansuda> adr's or geo points.
  116. [02:19:06] <briansuda> Google has KML (XML) for maps
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  118. [02:19:27] <jibot> pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
  119. [02:19:56] <briansuda> directions sprung-up after Bill Gates mentioned it, we have to be careful of making problems so we can make solutions
  120. [02:21:09] <ajturner> heh
  121. [02:21:14] <ajturner> well, for me, it was apt timing
  122. [02:21:22] <ajturner> as I was just putting together a directions based app
  123. [02:23:28] <briansuda> does that help answer some of your questions? or did i just make it more confusing
  124. [02:23:53] <ajturner> well, I guess it reconfirms that MF is kind of a "lazy-web" standards process... if they build it... we'll possibly come ;)
  125. [02:24:05] <ajturner> I mean, it's a good, pragmatic approach, but not one that can really have a "drive"
  126. [02:24:31] <mfbot> [[events/2006-06-16-atmedia-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-06-16-atmedia-microformats&diff=0&oldid=7252 * Brian * (+1095) 2006-06-16 @media2006 microformats sessions -
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  128. [02:25:00] <jibot> tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
  129. [02:25:26] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  130. [02:25:38] <tantek> drew, still around and awake?
  131. [02:25:43] <tantek> I had dinner with Jason Santa Maria and have some answers ;)
  132. [02:35:17] <mfbot> [[events/2006-06-21-supernova-decentralizing-data]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-06-21-supernova-decentralizing-data&diff=0&oldid=7253 * Brian * (+609) 2006-06-21 Supernova Decentralizing Data Workshop -
  133. [02:39:18] <mfbot> [[events/2006-06-21-supernova-decentralizing-data]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-06-21-supernova-decentralizing-data&diff=0&oldid=7254 * Brian * (+1435) added additional speakers' presentations
  134. [02:39:39] <mfbot> [[events/2006-06-21-supernova-decentralizing-data]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-06-21-supernova-decentralizing-data&diff=0&oldid=7255 * Brian * (-168) Summary -
  135. [02:40:10] <mfbot> [[events/2006-06-21-supernova-decentralizing-data]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-06-21-supernova-decentralizing-data&diff=0&oldid=7256 * Brian * (+131) Tantek Çelik of Technorati: Decentralizing Data -
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  137. [02:47:57] <mfbot> [[events/2006-07-11-an-event-apart-microformats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=events/2006-07-11-an-event-apart-microformats&diff=0&oldid=7257 * Brian * (+615) 2006-07-11 An Event Apart -
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  140. [02:54:28] <mfbot> [[irc]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=irc&diff=0&oldid=7258 * ScottReynen * (+86) Added Atom feed for logs
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  142. [02:55:29] <mfbot> [[screencasts]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=screencasts&diff=0&oldid=7259 * Brian * (+174) Added Liveclipboard screencast
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  144. [03:04:51] <jibot> ryanlowe is Ryan Lowe, http://www.fanconcert.com
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  146. [03:06:35] <jibot> bewest is curious about emerging standards and works for Alexa.com
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  163. [05:18:18] <mfbot> [[media-formats]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=media-formats&diff=0&oldid=7260 * DeanEro * (+211) Current Media Formats - AVI RIFF tags and reference
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  166. [05:30:11] <jibot> Jedi_ is Jedi <http://Jedi.org/> (+08:00) and working at Creative Commons Taiwan <http://creativecommons.org.tw/>
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  182. [08:27:52] <jibot> Charl is Charl van Niekerk and writes about standards at http://standards.za.net/
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  185. [09:06:31] <Ciaran_> Can anyone take a look at a page and tell me if the hCard on it is ok?
  186. [09:06:44] <Ciaran_> I can't seem to find any online validators etc. and Tails is having a problem with it
  187. [09:07:07] <tantek> Ciaran, try X2V
  188. [09:07:17] <tantek> Tails has some bugs
  189. [09:07:30] <Ciaran_> aha, X2V is another extension?
  190. [09:07:40] <tantek> X2V converts hCards into vCards
  191. [09:07:46] <tantek> and provides warnings for common errors
  192. [09:07:53] <Ciaran_> aha, great thanks
  193. [09:07:54] <tantek> it's in the implementations section in the hCard spec
  194. [09:08:10] <Ciaran_> The main problem is I've used a type/value in an email address and Tails is ignoring it
  195. [09:09:25] <Ciaran_> That vCard looks fine... looks like my markup was ok after all. Thanks Tantek.
  196. [09:09:48] <tantek> np
  197. [09:10:43] <Ciaran_> It's nice to read the Wiki/list then come onto IRC and get help from a familiar name ;-)
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  200. [09:18:23] <tantek> Ciaran - now all I ask is that you help the next person with a similar question :)
  201. [09:19:59] <Ciaran_> Of course ;-)
  202. [09:20:44] <Ciaran_> Thunderbird hasn't made a great job of importing the card. I'll have to play with it for a while.
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  208. [09:50:12] <jibot> trovster is a web developer from the UK who writes on http://www.trovster.com and helps with www.multipack.co.uk
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  214. [10:01:05] <jibot> drewinthehead is Drew McLellan - watch him, he's tricky.
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  219. [10:07:11] <drewinthehead> mornin'
  220. [10:08:50] <JamesMellor> hello
  221. [10:10:24] <JamesMellor> re microformats-discuss mailing list, I have also had problems posting, tried a number of times and each time nothing.. couldn't post a reply to the recent message about this so thought i'd do it here
  222. [10:10:42] <JamesMellor> using gmail
  223. [10:12:06] <drewinthehead> this is odd. i had a post to mf-dev not show up, but i just presumed i'd posted from the wrong address and so it had been silently rejected
  224. [10:15:52] <JamesMellor> yes i thought i was getting reject too for some reason but can't see any reason why that would have happened
  225. [10:16:00] <JamesMellor> *rejected
  226. [10:16:36] <Ciaran_> I tried posting on Saturday from Gmail and it didn't show u
  227. [10:16:54] <Ciaran_> er, up. However, it was my first post so I assumed it just went wrong.
  228. [10:17:12] <JamesMellor> yes that's what I thought too when I posted about 3 months ago
  229. [10:23:39] * dc__ (n=dctanner@bb-87-81-165-34.ukonline.co.uk) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  230. [10:25:17] <chucker> JamesMellor: some Colin guy seems to have the same problem
  231. [10:42:34] <drewinthehead> i'm not sure who runs the mail server, but it looks like it needs a kick. this isn't just one or two people having trouble, by the sound of it
  232. [10:53:42] <JamesMellor> no according to the list a few others have
  233. [10:54:07] <JamesMellor> it stops me from posting, i just read at the moment
  234. [10:54:14] <JamesMellor> :/
  235. [11:04:39] * tantek (n=tantek@h-68-167-74-227.nycmny83.covad.net) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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  238. [11:15:16] <drewinthehead> tantek - do you know who looks after mailman? seems like there's a fair number of people having posting issues
  239. [11:17:51] <drewinthehead> possibly enough to suggest more than multiple cases of individual problems
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  242. [11:21:55] <jibot> gsnedders is a 14 year old idiot from Scotland and pretends to have a website at http://geoffers.uni.cc/
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  263. [13:11:35] * edsu (n=esummers@66.187.134.52) has joined #microformats
  264. [13:11:36] <jibot> edsu is Ed Summers from the Library of Congress <http://www.inkdroid.org>
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  268. [13:26:53] <jibot> tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
  269. [13:27:18] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  270. [13:34:20] <Ciaran_> Does anyone know of either a Firefox extension or a Safari plugin that can export hCards to Address Book?
  271. [13:35:04] <drewinthehead> not on the mac, Ciaran_. for Windows there's a version of Tails which exports to vCards
  272. [13:35:42] * pnhChris (n=cac6982@c-68-39-79-212.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) has joined #microformats
  273. [13:35:43] <jibot> pnhChris is Chris Casciano, blogs at http://placenamehere.com/ , and a member of the Web Standards Project.
  274. [13:42:30] <Ciaran_> drewinthehead - Yeah, I've had a look at that. Unfortunately I keep my address book on the Mac.
  275. [13:42:40] <Ciaran_> Hm, I wonder how hard it'd be to write some Applescript to do it
  276. [13:44:27] <drewinthehead> i'm not sure if there's a favelet to feed the current page to X2V - but that'd be one solution
  277. [13:44:49] <Ciaran_> vCard isn't Address Book's native format I don't think.
  278. [13:44:55] <Ciaran_> I might have a crack at it when I get home ;-)
  279. [13:58:38] * sreynen (n=sreynen@216.81.176.51) has joined #microformats
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  282. [14:15:28] <drewinthehead> Address Book will import vCard just fine, however, Ciaran_
  283. [14:17:41] <tantek> drew, see http://favelets.com/
  284. [14:18:21] <drewinthehead> thanks tantek, i thought that'd be likely
  285. [14:21:31] * briansuda (n=briansud@h-68-166-252-239.chcgilgm.covad.net) has joined #microformats
  286. [14:21:31] * ChanServ sets mode +o briansuda
  287. [14:21:32] <jibot> briansuda is brian suda of http://suda.co.uk/ and http://claimid.com/briansuda in his freetime he works on the X2V microformats parser (-0600 CST)
  288. [14:22:09] * ichigo (n=ichigo@M778P007.adsl.highway.telekom.at) has joined #microformats
  289. [14:27:48] <briansuda> tantek, i have updated X2V to pull the a.include, it seems to work (i need to tweak some output issues - there are missing spaces, but that has nothing to do with a.include) have a test http://suda.co.uk/projects/X2V/get-vcal.php?beta=yes&uri=http%3A//tantek.com/
  290. [14:27:59] * KevinMarks (n=Snak@pdpc/supporter/active/kevinmarks) Quit ("The computer fell asleep")
  291. [14:29:27] <tantek> hey brian, very cool
  292. [14:29:32] <tantek> about the mimetype
  293. [14:29:39] <tantek> i thought about text/xml
  294. [14:29:48] <tantek> but that doesn't work for all HTML fragments
  295. [14:31:49] <briansuda> not with all HTML true, but with all XHTML it should
  296. [14:33:59] <mfbot> [[hcalendar]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcalendar&diff=0&oldid=7261 * Brian * (+62) added yahoo local into examples
  297. [14:34:42] <tantek> the point is that a "chunk" of well-formed HTML is more than just well-formed XML
  298. [14:34:55] <mfbot> [[hcard]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard&diff=0&oldid=7262 * Brian * (+105) added yahoo local example
  299. [14:35:03] <tantek> thus "text/xml" would work, but is semantically weak
  300. [14:35:37] <Ciaran_> huh, so you're including in the location from a different event? Interesting.
  301. [14:36:36] <mfbot> [[hreview]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hreview&diff=0&oldid=7263 * Brian * (+135) Examples in the wild -
  302. [14:37:42] <tantek> Ciaran, exactly
  303. [14:37:57] <tantek> it's what a human would do, since you've already seen the details once
  304. [14:38:42] <mfbot> [[hlisting-proposal]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hlisting-proposal&diff=0&oldid=7264 * Brian * (+107) Added Edgeio as "examples in the wild"
  305. [14:39:51] <Ciaran_> Would it be allowed across pages?
  306. [14:40:06] <Ciaran_> like have the description on a different URL entirely?
  307. [14:40:54] <Ciaran_> It could cause issues with how deep a user-agent is expected to spider
  308. [14:42:24] <tantek> it is not allowed across pages
  309. [14:42:26] <tantek> local references only
  310. [14:42:28] * neuraxon77 (n=craig@cust7394.vic01.dataco.com.au) has left #microformats
  311. [14:42:32] <briansuda> across pages is not a good idea, it could cause a recursive nightmare! plus HTML can be used offline and requiring documents that are not available is not beneficial
  312. [14:42:37] <tantek> see http://microformats.org/wiki/include-patterns for details
  313. [14:42:54] <tantek> also, all use cases found so far are on the same page
  314. [14:43:03] <tantek> thus we keep it as simple as possible
  315. [14:44:13] * boneill (n=boneill@hatstand.ecs.soton.ac.uk) Quit ()
  316. [14:44:43] <Ciaran_> I could see certain uses for doing it non-locally but like you say parsing would be a nightmare
  317. [14:47:26] <tantek> it is far more trouble than it is worth
  318. [14:48:04] <tantek> you might say that Ted Nelson's Xanadu tried to make true cross document transclusions work, and that work has been going for *decades*.
  319. [14:48:54] <briansuda> the other issue is that data that is out-of-site is more likely to get stale or be incorrect, when you are spanning pages/sites this likelyhood increases
  320. [14:49:22] <drewinthehead> plus we'd need to start taking robots.txt into account...
  321. [14:49:45] <Ciaran_> It'd be nice to include from the more esoteric protocols too ;-P ed2k:// anyone?
  322. [14:49:54] <briansuda> things get big quick - not worth the small gains, just replicate the data
  323. [14:50:50] * chucker_ (n=chucker@p5489DB60.dip.t-dialin.net) Quit ()
  324. [14:51:08] <briansuda> we can certainly reference them, inclusion only occurs within the same document, which is really protocol inspecific
  325. [14:52:12] <briansuda> you COULD write a microformats parse to sit inside your email client and parse any incomming events mentioned in the message. This would (sort of) be over smtp:// (although it is local)
  326. [14:52:23] <Ciaran_> nice
  327. [14:53:00] <Ciaran_> cid:// evem
  328. [14:53:07] <Ciaran_> er even
  329. [14:54:44] * gsnedders (n=gsnedder@host86-139-126-254.range86-139.btcentralplus.com) Quit ()
  330. [15:01:42] <Ciaran_> Atom seems to have gotten around the mime-type format by defining @type="text|html|xhtml|real-mime-type"
  331. [15:03:21] * trovster (n=trov@creation1.plus.com) has joined #microformats
  332. [15:03:21] <jibot> trovster is a web developer from the UK who writes on http://www.trovster.com and helps with www.multipack.co.uk
  333. [15:47:33] * mlinksva (n=mlinksva@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/mlinksva) has joined #microformats
  334. [15:47:34] <jibot> mlinksva is Mike Linksvayer and from Creative Commons
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  337. [15:50:44] <jibot> gsnedders is a 14 year old idiot from Scotland and pretends to have a website at http://geoffers.uni.cc/
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  347. [16:31:24] <jibot> cgriego is Chris Griego (-06:00) and a front-end developer at RD2, Inc.
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  352. [17:06:49] <jibot> tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
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  365. [17:27:19] <jibot> bewest is curious about emerging standards and works for Alexa.com
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  371. [18:32:01] * drewinthehead (n=drewinth@chauchcr.gotadsl.co.uk) has joined #microformats
  372. [18:32:01] <jibot> drewinthehead is Drew McLellan - watch him, he's tricky.
  373. [18:33:31] <briansuda> For those interested in the GEO microformats, i have been playing around with converting the GEO microformat to a KML file then feeding that into google maps. Instant maps mash-ups! (http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=http://suda.co.uk/projects/X2V/get-kml.php%3Furi%3Dhttp%253A//austin.adactio.com&t=k&om=1)
  374. [18:33:35] * schepers (n=schepers@66-194-222-226.static.twtelecom.net) has joined #microformats
  375. [18:34:24] <drewinthehead> looks pretty neat, briansuda
  376. [18:34:44] <briansuda> thanks, i just sent an email to the discuss list too
  377. [18:34:48] <hober> sweet
  378. [18:35:05] <drewinthehead> i have plenty of test data http://getlpg.org.uk/ ;)
  379. [18:35:11] <briansuda> i love "piping" data through multiple web services!
  380. [18:36:22] <hober> You can s/rss/kml/ in eventful URLs to get KML from arbitrary event searches etc.
  381. [18:36:43] <briansuda> all you need for google maps is a URL to a KML file
  382. [18:37:05] <briansuda> drewinthehead, i get errors in your GEO files, i'm looking into it now
  383. [18:37:14] * ajturner (n=irc@s233-64-126-217.try.wideopenwest.com) has joined #microformats
  384. [18:37:35] <drewinthehead> i just noticed that too. could well be me, but GEO is simple enough that it ought not be
  385. [18:37:49] <briansuda> no, i think it might be me... i'm looking into it how
  386. [18:37:56] <briansuda> .. into it now
  387. [18:40:26] <briansuda> ok, it works now http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=http://suda.co.uk/projects/X2V/get-kml.php%3Furi%3Dhttp://getlpg.org.uk/stations/edinburgh-city-of&ie=UTF8&t=k&om=1
  388. [18:40:37] <deanero> brainsuda: that's super awesome. i want to use something like that for band tour dates
  389. [18:40:41] <briansuda> hober, is there a better format than KML?
  390. [18:41:04] <briansuda> deanero, all you need to do is add class="geo" and the lat/lon and the KML does the rest
  391. [18:41:15] <briansuda> poormans, Google API
  392. [18:42:02] <drewinthehead> poormans pah!
  393. [18:43:13] <briansuda> i need to clean-up the output so you get something in the bubble, but all the technology is there working
  394. [18:46:08] <drewinthehead> tim o'reilly would be proud.
  395. [18:48:59] <sreynen> i'd like to see something like that as a wrapper around the maps API, so you could just give it the local ID of the points you want plotted and your API key, and it would do the rest
  396. [18:49:38] <drewinthehead> prize to the first person to get it piped through ten web services!
  397. [18:49:55] <briansuda> don't tempt me!
  398. [18:50:15] <briansuda> i'm also already piping my output through a Tidy webservice as well!
  399. [18:52:47] <drewinthehead> one of your own?
  400. [18:53:03] <drewinthehead> i've had lots of trouble with differences between Tidys
  401. [18:57:09] * tantek (n=tantek@h-68-167-74-227.nycmny83.covad.net) has joined #microformats
  402. [18:57:09] <jibot> tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
  403. [18:57:34] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  404. [19:00:45] * drewinthehead thinks he has include-pattern working with a.include in hKit
  405. [19:02:23] <drewinthehead> just need a test case and i'm good
  406. [19:02:49] <briansuda> http://tantek.com has an a.include example
  407. [19:03:01] <briansuda> i have also been using the w3c tidy service
  408. [19:04:13] * tantek (n=tantek@h-68-167-74-227.nycmny83.covad.net) Quit ()
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  410. [19:04:30] <drewinthehead> ah, i don't have hCalendar support yet ;)
  411. [19:04:44] <drewinthehead> but i could use it as a basis for my own test
  412. [19:04:50] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  413. [19:04:57] <briansuda> i think there is an hCard for the place, but it might not be including it yet
  414. [19:05:57] * cgriego (n=cgriego@e2.87.5d45.static.theplanet.com) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  415. [19:06:13] <drewinthehead> the include is including the hCard, but i'm not parsing the hCalendar event to find it yet
  416. [19:06:24] <drewinthehead> i need to get off my arse and get that done
  417. [19:06:25] <briansuda> gotcha
  418. [19:08:51] <drewinthehead> i found 34 hCards on tantek.com
  419. [19:09:15] <drewinthehead> i don't think i even know 34 people ;)
  420. [19:09:27] <briansuda> :)
  421. [19:10:48] <tantek> not all of them are people :)
  422. [19:11:33] <drewinthehead> my point still stands :D
  423. [19:12:47] <drewinthehead> ok, i'm pretty sure hKit now supports a.include fully
  424. [19:12:50] * tantek (n=tantek@h-68-167-74-227.nycmny83.covad.net) Quit ()
  425. [19:16:37] * schepers (n=schepers@66-194-222-226.static.twtelecom.net) Quit ("Free at last!")
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  427. [19:18:01] * ChanServ sets mode +o KevinMarks
  428. [19:19:34] <deanero> yahoo's rest api for geocodes is pretty snazzy
  429. [19:20:39] <drewinthehead> unfortunately their data only seems to cover the US
  430. [19:21:21] <deanero> that's too bad
  431. [19:24:43] <bewest> google opened their geocoder
  432. [19:24:49] <bewest> does 8 countries iirc
  433. [19:25:20] <ajturner> google's geocoder is nice too - and JSON support is really easy
  434. [19:26:01] <ajturner> mapquest has a geocoder with 'worldwide' support - but only goes to city level outside US & canada
  435. [19:29:33] <bewest> google keeps coming out with more services than I can keep up with
  436. [19:29:42] <bewest> and along with it, more data formats than I can keep up with
  437. [19:29:58] <bewest> although hopefully they'll find their gData format sufficient for awhile
  438. [19:30:13] * bewest might write a gData -> h<format>
  439. [19:32:19] * schepers (n=schepers@66-194-222-226.static.twtelecom.net) has joined #microformats
  440. [19:34:26] <ajturner> is there a ruby wrapper for gdata?
  441. [19:34:51] <bewest> dunno
  442. [19:35:02] * deanero needs to relent and learn more js than the trivial client-side stuff he;s done over the years
  443. [19:35:03] <ajturner> doesn't look like it
  444. [19:35:11] <bewest> but if such a thing existed, you could easily write pipes for their calendar app
  445. [19:35:18] <deanero> a ruby wrapper would be more my speed
  446. [19:35:22] <ajturner> there isa gcalendar api
  447. [19:35:34] <ajturner> I've already written a ruby GCalendar XML parser
  448. [19:35:48] <ajturner> deanero - why JS when you can RJS? :)
  449. [19:35:57] * drewinthehead shudders
  450. [19:36:22] <ajturner> has anyone used the various microformat parsers/tools in ruby?
  451. [19:39:05] * KevinMarks (n=Snak@pdpc/supporter/active/kevinmarks) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  452. [19:41:59] <deanero> no, but that sounds interesting. do you have links?
  453. [19:42:13] * tantek (n=tantek@mail.amscan.org) has joined #microformats
  454. [19:42:14] <jibot> tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
  455. [19:42:38] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  456. [19:42:59] <ajturner> http://trac.labnotes.org/cgi-bin/trac.cgi/wiki/Ruby/MicroformatParser
  457. [19:44:43] <ajturner> there is also this
  458. [19:44:44] <ajturner> http://rubyforge.org/projects/mftools/
  459. [19:45:08] <ajturner> but no releases yet (btw - the last was in the IRC logs from Feb 9 :) )
  460. [19:53:40] * ajturner (n=irc@s233-64-126-217.try.wideopenwest.com) Quit ()
  461. [19:56:14] * izo_ (n=izo_@boi59-1-82-66-128-84.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #microformats
  462. [19:59:49] <tantek> greetings
  463. [20:00:08] <tantek> it looks like a.include as a secondary include-pattern in addition to object.include has been fairly well received
  464. [20:02:38] <drewinthehead> implementation seems easier, for sure
  465. [20:02:46] <drewinthehead> no CSS and browser compat to worry about
  466. [20:03:27] <pnhChris> anyone from yahoo weigh in yet?
  467. [20:05:05] <mfbot> [[include-pattern]] M http://microformats.org/wiki?title=include-pattern&diff=0&oldid=7265 * Tantek * (+222) added proposal
  468. [20:05:17] <tantek> the one major concern has been cross-document includes which have always been outside the scope of include-pattern
  469. [20:05:24] <tantek> from the page:
  470. [20:05:31] <tantek> "Note 1: the object data attribute MUST be a local ID reference. External references (which would require a consuming application to load an external resource) are currently not supported by this method."
  471. [20:05:34] * tantek (n=tantek@mail.amscan.org) Quit ()
  472. [20:16:46] * pnhChris (n=cac6982@c-68-39-79-212.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) Quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
  473. [20:20:03] * Atamido (n=atamido@cpe-67-9-173-252.austin.res.rr.com) Quit ("Chatzilla 0.9.73-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.8.0.1/2006012608]")
  474. [20:28:28] * tantek (n=tantek@mail.amscan.org) has joined #microformats
  475. [20:28:29] <jibot> tantek is Tantek <http://tantek.com> and works on Technorati and develops microformats <http://microformats.org>
  476. [20:28:55] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  477. [20:41:22] <mfbot> [[include-pattern]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=include-pattern&diff=0&oldid=7266 * Tantek * (+1778) added a href include example and proposal
  478. [20:42:31] <briansuda> tantek, i added to the stub pages last night and this morning, i'll try to add some more tonight, but without actually attending some of those events it is difficult for me to flush out all the details, but i'll keep adding information as i come across it
  479. [20:42:57] <tantek> definitely, they look great
  480. [20:43:15] <tantek> mostly it is about extracting what information you can find about the events scattered across various blog posts etc.
  481. [20:47:58] * edsu (n=esummers@66.187.134.52) Quit ("leaving")
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  487. [21:30:11] * ChanServ sets mode +o tantek
  488. [21:45:16] <gsnedders> g'night
  489. [21:45:37] * gsnedders (n=gsnedder@host86-139-126-254.range86-139.btcentralplus.com) Quit ()
  490. [21:47:22] * Harry_Slaughter (n=harry@pool-71-116-86-17.snfcca.dsl-w.verizon.net) Quit ("http://devbee.com/")
  491. [21:57:06] * briansuda (n=briansud@h-68-166-252-239.chcgilgm.covad.net) Quit ()
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  495. [22:29:58] <drewinthehead> interesting feedback on a.include on the list
  496. [22:33:45] * tantek (n=tantek@h-68-167-74-227.nycmny83.covad.net) Quit ()
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  501. [22:50:19] <jibot> Atamido is Paul Bryson, http://orangeman.commo.de/
  502. [22:56:45] * remi (n=remi@c207.134.231-81.clta.globetrotter.net) has joined #microformats
  503. [22:56:46] <jibot> remi is Remi Prevost, a web developper (yeah, that's how we spell "developer" in french) from Quebec and blogs about web stuff at <http://remiprevost.com/>
  504. [23:50:32] * vant (n=vant@c-24-18-237-78.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) has joined #microformats
  505. [23:52:38] <mfbot> [[hcard-brainstorming]] http://microformats.org/wiki?title=hcard-brainstorming&diff=0&oldid=7267 * PhilipAshlock * (+470) Spam prevention -
  506. [23:55:11] * ryanlowe (n=chatzill@CPE00045a734098-CM001225d89e7c.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #microformats
  507. [23:55:12] <jibot> ryanlowe is Ryan Lowe, http://www.fanconcert.com

These logs were automatically created by mflogbot on chat.freenode.net using a modified version of the Java IRC LogBot.

See http://microformats.org/wiki/mflogbot for more information.